The Pete Plan etc

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Re: The Pete Plan etc

Post by Iain »

Bad start but rescued the session today. Intended to do my first short interval session for months, but not wise to choose a session with 1ks in it (even if an easier version than the 4x1k). Was struggling in the warm up to get below 2:00 (initially R31!) Didn't make it to halfway through the 1st 500. Rested and regrouped and decided on a positively split grey row to set a few initial nonathlon scores. Realised I was on for my best 10' since restarting in December, so went for that, rested then restarted what was a 6675m 30' despite slowing twice. However was at 92%+ HR for 24' excluding 2 brief slows (when HR dropped to 90%). With the interim scores scraped 7000 Nonathlon points, better than last season although this is as a lightweight rather than a heavy.

Time: Distnc Rate Pace HRMax % HRMin %
04:01.5 1,000 28 02:00.8 167 90.8% 101 54.9% - got ugly early, felt more than 91% HRMax!
00:51.9 0,220 31 01:58.0 167 90.8% 114 62.0% - Not happening today!
05:00.0 1,233 27 02:01.7 174 94.6% 103 56.0% - Started with 2:04 target and got faster.
05:00.0 1,212 26 02:05.2 179 97.3% 167 90.8% - Slowed to 2:16 for about 1min, so pleased to get it back, extrapolates to 11.5S quicker 2k than last year.
14:53.4 3665 27.2 2:01.9 179 97.3%
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Re: The Pete Plan etc

Post by Iain »

Well no excuse yesterday, went for the 50k I put off last Monday, plan to go sub 4 hours. My preparation had followed Pete's prescription (keep going at normal sessions but do hour+ on SS). Previously only done 3 50km (and only twice longer on a "nearly" continuous row). Having rarely hit the tough ending described my most FM rowers I underestimated this!

Time: Distnc Rate Pace HRMax % HRMin %
:23:51.9 5,000. 16 02:23.2 - 0.0% - - Turned HR App off moving it so not in reflection!
:23:55.9 5,000. 17 02:23.6 - 0.0% -
:23:54.0 5,000. 17 02:23.4 - 0.0% -
:23:53.5 5,000. 18 02:23.4 159 86.4% -
:23:55.1 5,000. 18 02:23.5 158 85.9% 146 - restarted App as finally noticed the display hadn't changed after nearly an hour!
:23:55.3 5,000. 18 02:23.5 159 86.4% 146
:23:54.4 5,000. 19 02:23.4 159 86.4% 143 - Still going without incident although getting tougher and had to up rating when failed to get below 2:25 @ R18
:23:58.3 5,000. 19 02:23.8 161 87.5% 151 - Wheels fell off gradually part way through.
:10:37.0 2,195. 19 02:25.1 161 87.5% 152 - Pushed on to FM knowing I would need to slow after
:13:25.6 2,805. 19 02:23.6 164 89.1% 145 - all over the place (flattered by no drink stop), plenty of 2:27s, wouldn't have kept going if didn't know sub 4 to be had if kept going
:24:05.9 5,000. 19 02:24.6 165 89.7% 150 - Despite pushing hard for final 600, although only managed 2:08.
3:59:26.7 50000 18.0 2:23.7 165 89.7%


So like most rowers, tough at the end of the FM, the extra 7.8k nearly broke me, finished in a worse state than any previous rows except when I "bonked" when doing FM starved. Everything hurt by the end except strangely no PITA! Looked back at 50k in 2021 that I had recognised as a car-crash. Did set out at 2:16-17 (I was much fitter then and had been doing 105 min SS for a few months before.) Looking at what happened, although I slowed a little from 25km, the real impact was similar to this (although slowed much more with extra drink stops). Note to self, only do this if properly prepared!

By 6 hours later I was in strange position where the main pains were in my right quad and left glute, so hate to think what had happened to my stroke! On a plus point my back was merely tired with no recurrence of recent problems.

Not sure I can face the FM I was hoping to do next weekend.
Last edited by Iain on Mon May 08, 2023 5:09 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: The Pete Plan etc

Post by JonT »

I have nothing but admiration Iain. I can only imagine the struggle towards the end. ^O^ ^O^
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Re: The Pete Plan etc

Post by spidermac »

Iain for a man who is perma injured/ not motivated etc thats a very impressive row way above anything I will ever try. Congrats hope it gives u a good boost in your training. =D> =D> =D> =D> =D> Take a bow.
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Re: The Pete Plan etc

Post by Ian Bee »

Nice work on finishing your 50k Iain - these are seriously mentally and physically challenging distances ^O^
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Re: The Pete Plan etc

Post by Iain »

Many thanks for the encouragement Jon, Spider & Ian. I was beginning to wonder whether anyone else looked at this thread anymore! so LSD today to see whether I was recovered:

Time: Distnc Rate Pace HRMax % HRMin %
15:00.0 3,132 17 02:23.7 148 80.4% 096 52.2% - Less work per stroke than usual
15:00.0 3,134 16 02:23.6 151 82.1% 142 77.2% - More like it
15:00.0 3,135 15 02:23.5 153 83.2% 147 79.9% - Concentrating on high work per stroke
15:00.0 3,220 17 02:19.8 163 88.6% 150 81.5% - All seems to be working again if HR a bit high
1:00:00 12621 16.3 2:22.6 163 88.6%
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Re: The Pete Plan etc

Post by Iain »

Well a real PP session today, after weekend of CBAs, my first short PP interval session since restarting. Decided to start conservatively (2:01/2) and neg split. Wasn't as painful as I had feared!

Time: Dist Rate Pace HRMax % HRMin %
02:01.1 500 27 02:01.1 160 87.0% 094 51.1%
02:00.8 500 28 02:00.8 167 90.8% 105 57.1%
02:00.5 500 28 02:00.5 170 92.4% 103 56.0%
02:00.1 500 28 02:00.1 172 93.5% 115 62.5%
01:59.8 500 28 01:59.8 172 93.5% 114 62.0%
01:58.8 500 29 01:58.8 174 94.6% 118 64.1%
01:58.1 500 29 01:58.1 176 95.7% 121 65.8%
01:50.8 500 37 01:50.8 180 97.8% 127 69.0% - SB only 1S slower than only standalone 500 done since I restarted and 2nd 800 in Nonathlon! Happy with that.
15:50.0 4000 29.1 1:58.7 180 97.8%

Hope to follow up with 750s fairly shortly, may target 2:02 if fresh.
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Re: The Pete Plan etc

Post by Ian Bee »

Nice work Iain - I share the disinterest in the sprint sessions, so well done on the -ve splits 💪
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Re: The Pete Plan etc

Post by spidermac »

Well done Ian a great -ve split. =D> =D> I always try to start the first round or 2 of these sessions a bit easier - seems to take that to wake me up & can always give it the beans at the end. Starting too fast its very easy to give up in the earlier rounds thinking " I can`t maintain/-ve split this for the rest of the wout!!"
So applying the above today was 5x1500R5. HD`d on this a week ago starting at 2.00 min pace so decided to start a bit slower.
Wup - 2k
Time dist spm HR split
06:02.1 1500 28 150 02:00.7
06:01.1 1500 28 156 02:00.3
05:59.2 1500 28 158 01:59.7
05:57.6 1500 29 159 01:59.2
05:54.4 1500 30 160 01:58.1
29:54.4 7500 28 156 01:59.6
CD - 2k
Happy to finnish & -ve split & go sub 2.00 for the wout. Need to get used to higher ratings for these distances. HR never exceeded 160 - not sure if thats because I am well below previous fitness levels or a result of the pneumonia earlier this year as I was hitiing hi 160 HR`s last year or 2. :(
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Re: The Pete Plan etc

Post by Iain »

Thanks Ian & Spider. This followed a pathetic H/D on an intended 4 x 1k on only 2nd interval, so know i needed to finish this one! Interesting HR Spider, no idea why your HR is so low. I find that after time out my HR increases quicker for a similar RPE, but well done on a strong workout. I dream of rating R28 for a long interval session at the moment (I suspect I will be around there for the 5 x 750 I am currently considering)! I would have said no need to push this as you will have to increase the rating as the pace increases. Unless you increase the work per stroke, you will quickly have to be R29 on this session with the new target.

- Iain
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Re: The Pete Plan etc

Post by Iain »

Although physically fine, just felt dull this morning after a day of disrupted trains and worse than usual sleep. So decided on LSD, but progressively reduced the rating at constant pace while trying to optimise every stroke. Result:

Time: Dist Rate Pace HRMax % HRMin %
15:00.0 3,145 16 02:23.1 146 79.3% 070 38.0%
15:00.0 3,155 15 02:22.6 152 82.6% 143 77.7%
15:00.0 3,167 14 02:22.1 158 85.9% 149 81.0%
15:00.0 3,154 13 02:22.7 161 87.5% 155 84.2% - SPI 9.3, highest for a while! Struggled to hit 12SPM after rating drifted up
15:00.0 3,166 17 02:22.1 159 86.4% 153 83.2%
1:15:00 15781 15.0 2:22.6 161 87.5%
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Re: The Pete Plan etc

Post by spidermac »

Turning up & doing a wout is half the battle Iain - well done, had similar feelings myself today - 3 wouts in a row a first this year,
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Re: The Pete Plan etc

Post by Iain »

Well another CBA yesterday morning, so made today's count. 5x750 r2:30 (preparation for CTC so knocked 1' off rest) Target was 2:02 and try and manage 1:59 for the last. Got carried away during what was supposed to be a cool down for an SB 30'. Good confidence boost for CTC.

Time: Dist Rate Pace HRMax % HRMin %
03:01.6 750 27 02:01.1 168 91.3% 098 53.3% - Couldn't hit 2:02s so settled at 2:01
03:00.9 750 27 02:00.6 174 94.6% 108 58.7% - faster than intended, feeling good
02:59.8 750 28 01:59.9 176 95.7% 119 64.7% - can't hold pace today, but legs holding up (no acid noticed)
02:58.1 750 28 01:58.7 181 98.4% 122 66.3% - Went out hard to continue neg split and got into rhythm
02:54.5 750 30 01:56.3 180 97.8% 122 66.3% - Slowed 600 - 450 1:59s, but happy with finish
14:55.1 3750 28.0 1:59.3 181 98.4%

05:00.0 1,133 23 02:12.4 166 90.2% 109 59.2% - messing with HR monitor at start, dropped to 2:43 avg.
05:00.0 1,180 24 02:07.1 174 94.6% 165 89.7% - didn't feel that fast, finished strong
05:00.0 1,130 21 02:12.7 173 94.0% 162 88.0% - slowed a lot then got second wind
05:00.0 1,143 22 02:11.2 174 94.6% 170 92.4% - slowed a bit, but quickly picked up
01:43.4 414 25 02:04.9 177 96.2% 170 92.4% - finished to 5k with kick
03:16.6 749 23 02:11.2 176 95.7% 169 91.8% - slowed then back on it for 6k
01:04.1 251 24 02:07.7 177 96.2% 173 94.0% - finished 6k strongly, but no sprint
03:55.9 919 24 02:08.3 177 96.2% 170 92.4% - slowed a bit then finished at semi-sprint
30:00. 6919 22.9 2:10.1 177 96.2%

So 3 more >800 Nonathlon scores and a pace for the 750s only 0.6S/500m less than recent 8 x 500! Got to be happy with that!
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Re: The Pete Plan etc

Post by Iain »

LSD this morning, had time so extended to 90min, but as yesterday was hard, kept pace fairly flat.

Time: Dist Rate Pace HRMax % HRMin %

15:00.0 3,146 17 02:23.0 144 78.3% 091 49.5%
15:00.0 3,147 17 02:23.0 151 82.1% 148 80.4%
15:00.0 3,148 17 02:22.9 151 82.1% 145 78.8%
15:00.0 3,149 17 02:22.9 151 82.1% 147 79.9%
15:00.0 3,150 17 02:22.9 152 82.6% 147 79.9%
15:00.0 3,155 17 02:22.6 151 82.1% 145 78.8%
1:30:00 18887 17.0 2:23.0 152 82.6%

Lowest HR on LSD (previously 153 on hr LSD). RHR has also dropped, regularly in 70s when first sit down and yesterday saw 60, RHR will be lower as I will have been walking around getting equip together before these readings. Although maybe a bit less stressed with the thought of the session to come!
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Re: The Pete Plan etc

Post by stumpy »

Just having a little peep Iain. That’s a good effort there mate well done.
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Re: The Pete Plan etc

Post by Iain »

Thanks for the encouragement Colin. So today managed the CTC as a substitute for the normal rest 4x1k. Normally I paddle until 1' rest left, but today just did 3 strokes. Didn't use rolling starts as didn't want to risk missing the start and losing more time than I gained on the others as well as not wanting to do more metres than necessary :lol: Target 2:02 and try and break 4' for SB last.

Time: Dist Rate Pace HRMax % HRMin %
04:02.6 1,000 27 02:01.3 0.0% - Forgot to start HR APP :oops: felt long
04:01.2 1,000 27 02:00.6 174 94.6% 098 - hard t hit 2:01s, so faster than intended
03:58.7 1,000 28 01:59.4 177 96.2% 121 - much grimacing as bad as expected but pleased with result
03:56.6 1,000 29 01:58.3 178 96.7% 121 - tough from 150 in, slowed to 2:01 and delayed accel from last 450 - 400
15:59.1 4000 27.7 1:59.9 178 96.7%

Surprised HR lower than 750s, although only managed 156 on warm up. Really surprised to be sub 2:00 overall. 16 Nonathlon points takes me over 7300, second best Nonathlon score, so shows I am capable of better!
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Re: The Pete Plan etc

Post by spidermac »

Well done Iain nice -ve split too & well under target!!! =D> =D>
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Re: The Pete Plan etc

Post by Iain »

Thanks Spider.

Just an LSD for 75min today, but as I can't row tomorrow kept the rate low. Realised yesterday that if I can row with this work per stroke for 2k I could manage sub 8 (>10S SB) at 24SPM. As I find a free rate 2k so daunting may do 1500 like that and then accelerate at the end some time.

Time: Dist Rate Pace HRMax % HRMin %
15:00.0 3,146 15 02:23.0 150 81.5% 82 44.6% - started free rate, took a while to get to pace as no W/up.
15:00.0 3,145 14 02:23.1 152 82.6% 148 80.4%
15:00.0 3,146 14 02:23.0 156 84.8% 150 81.5%
15:00.0 3,151 14 02:22.8 158 85.9% 151 82.1%
15:00.0 3,155 14 02:22.6 159 86.4% 153 83.2%
1:15:00 15735 14.2 2:23.0 159 86.4%
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Re: The Pete Plan etc

Post by spidermac »

One of your substitute sessions & one I find as hard as 4x1k. :shock:
Wup - 2k
Time dist spm HR split
02:52.2 750 30 157 01:54.8
02:51.8 750 30 158 01:54.5
02:51.2 750 31 160 01:54.1
02:50.6 750 32 160 01:53.7 - thought I had shot my bolt :(
02:50.2 750 34 161 01:53.4 - mad sprint managed to hold -ve split.
14:15.9 3750 31 159 01:54.1
CD - 2k
That was hard !! HR finally above 160 - but sure I am suffering long term effects of the pneumonia as the last round was max & HR barely above the previous 2 rounds!!! #-o MAY have a go at CTC before end of the month but don`t think I will be beating this split as u managed to do Iain!! =D> =D> Think I need to be doing more hard sessions maybe 2 per week when I am not erging as much. #-o
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Re: The Pete Plan etc

Post by Iain »

Spider that is a very impressive session, not surprised it took a lot out of you! I agree this is tough (definitely tougher than the speed pyramid I replace with it), but for me not close to the 4x1k and the 750s are supposed to be 1S/500m quicker :shock: , I was 0.6S quicker. I have the advantage of coming from a very low base and this is my first cycle through the short intervals. Won't be so easy next time! Today managed first long intervals for over 2 months, the dreaded 4 x 2k. Didn't feel quite 100%, but warm up went ok so decided on a 2:09 initial target (that last session was 2:07.6 on the 1500s, but 2ks were 2:11.4 over a month before):

Time: Dist Rate Pace HRMax % HRMin %
08:32.3 2,000 23 02:08.1 165 89.7% 098 53.3% - rating below where it should be
08:29.4 2,000 23 02:07.4 169 91.8% 111 60.3% - Kept dropping to 2:09s, need higher rate
08:25.0 2,000 24 02:06.2 175 95.1% 119 64.7% - Much tougher
08:12.6 2,000 26 02:03.1 179 97.3% 119 64.7% - plenty of 2:06+ strokes, but strong final 500.
33:39.3 8000 23.9 2:06.2 179 97.3%

So next time need to start at pace of tough 3rd interval, appropriate as HR shows first 2 too easy. Should be OK if I can get the rating up, surprised I was struggling after the 3 short interval sessions.
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Re: The Pete Plan etc

Post by Iain »

After yesterday's session had severe PEMS yesterday evening so LSD this morning. BUt as I am not rowing tomorrow and was disappointed at the rating I managed yesterday, decided to start the session at 18SPM rather than my usual 16/7. Plenty of time so went a bit longer as well:


Time: Distnc Rate Pace HRMax % HRMin %
15:00.0 3,203 18 02:20.5 148 80.4% 090 48.9%
15:00.0 3,204 18 02:20.4 150 81.5% 141 76.6%
15:00.0 3,205 18 02:20.4 155 84.2% 145 78.8%
15:00.0 3,206 18 02:20.4 153 83.2% 146 79.3%
15:00.0 3,212 19 02:20.1 151 82.1% 145 78.8%
15:00.0 3,355 21 02:14.1 164 89.1% 149 81.0% - felt good and intending to do an hour soon so accelerated a bit
15:00.0 3,177 18 02:21.6 163 88.6% 146 79.3% - Slowed down intending to warm down, but kept this up for another interval
1:45:00 22562 18.6 2:19.6 164 89.1%

Happy with how HR stayed down despite slightly higher rating and pace. So do I do 1500 R24 followed by 500m free rate to set a 2k time, or do I do the hour next?
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Re: The Pete Plan etc

Post by Iain »

Yesterday stomach didn't feel too good, tried jumping on rower but struggled to hit 2:00 pace in warm up so just extended by cooling down and called it a day. So today wanted a result, had a go at the hour. Have to go back to June 2020 to find an unrestricted one! So high time to try. As a result not sure on pacing, so set Bronze: 800 Nonathlon points at 13,332. Silver: 13500, Stretch target 13,600.

Time: Distnc Rate Pace HRMax % HRMin %
10:00.0 2,276 22 02:11.8 160 87.0% 092 50.0% - Good start, HR rising slower the usual
10:00.0 2,278 21 02:11.7 168 91.3% 157 85.3% - Holding back
10:00.0 2,285 21 02:11.3 172 93.5% 165 89.7% - Allowing pace to creep up, watching HR
10:00.0 2,286 21 02:11.2 175 95.1% 169 91.8% - Feel better than usual, pace ragged (2:09 -12)
10:00.0 2,296 21 02:10.7 174 94.6% 171 92.9% - Pushing on
10:00.0 2,353 23 02:07.5 179 97.3% 171 92.9% - accelerated for last 3:00 finished at 1:53 pace.
1:00:00.0 13,774 21.5 02:10.7 179 97.3%

Very happy with that, over 90 Nonathlon points (faster than last year's 10k) although that is the easy points achhieved now, probably single figure gains from now on. Looks good for Solstice HM, but now unsure on pacing for that. Previously I was thinking 1:35, but after this keep thinking that 1:33 might be possible, only 1.5S/500m slower for a little over 50% more distance, but I could have gone faster on this as I was holding back for the first half and still had quite a bit left at the end. Against that I was above threshold HR from 40% in, so if I had allowed the pace to increase ealier, I don't know whether I could have kept it up. Anyway, my medium term goals of 7k 30 min and 21min 5k look that they are within my grasp. All I have to do is get my rating up for shorter pieces (ie CTCs) and things will be going well!
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Re: The Pete Plan etc

Post by spidermac »

Well done Iain HR tells the tale, but still agood sprint to finnish.
I managed a HM today only my 2nd one ever!! A bit of a mental battle but wanted to finnish & put down a marker.
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Re: The Pete Plan etc

Post by Iain »

Thanks Spider.

I didn't track HR for many years so have little certainty about what I can maintain at different levels of fitness over different distances. Had a look at last few years of PB thread and see very different results, but surprisingly few reporting PBs & HR data. Claudius seems to hold significantly below HRmax except for a finishing spurt, while Jon holds HR at high levels from early on. Does anyone reading this have a thought about what HR profile they would expect for any distance of 5k or higher?
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spidermac
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Joined: Thu Mar 05, 2009 4:31 pm

Re: The Pete Plan etc

Post by spidermac »

Hi Iain on a sample of 1, I find for anything over 1k it always pays to start a bit slower than overall target & slowly ramp it up. On 30min+ sessions I often find that holding a pace or going faster becomes easier quite a bit into the piece - almost like it takes this long to really get the aerobic system fully engaged. (probably means I should do longer wups but I can`t face more than 3k for sprints & always just do 1k for longer sessions :lol: . For me too fast too early can mean HD early on (psychological) & a build up of lactate in the legs (physical) . EM is a believer that it takes a long time to really wake up the aerobic system properly - he talks of 1hour on the bike & 30min pacing sessions on the water to warm up for 2k at his peak!!! gulp!. :shock:
Born 1957 71kg;6`2"
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