what training have free spirits been doing today?

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spidermac
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Re: what training have free spirits been doing today?

Post by spidermac »

Another mega mileage week Ian! ^O^ ^O^
Bad luck Iain maybe go a bit slower on the 200`s & empty the tank on last 1500m.
Managed to tweak my back last thursday :( at 18spm pulling too hard & not concentrating!!! Doh. Still a bit tender so thought try it out on a 30minR20 -
Wup - 1k
Time Dist spm HR split
06:00.0 1334 20 134 02:15.2
06:00.0 1335 20 140 02:14.9
06:00.0 1335 20 141 02:14.8
06:00.0 1335 20 146 02:14.8
06:00.0 1335 20 145 02:14.8
30:00.0 6668 20 141 02:14.9
CD - 1k
Very hi HR but happy to survive with back intact. :shock: Lots of skiing coming up so probably not much rowing in next few months before hitting it seriously again! :D
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Re: what training have free spirits been doing today?

Post by Ian Bee »

Iain - look forward to seeing your result on the CTC. I think I'm kidding myself into thinking that I should weight the 1500m reps considerably more than the 200s.

Spider - well done to keep it controlled with a poorly back. Keep it steady!

Back to some 5k sessions for me:
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Curious result according to the graphs - bit variable in pace, HR trace a bit spikey (though there were some anomalous readings there to throw off the data) and I'm sure I'm not the only one to have been caught about by the drop in temperature....
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Re: what training have free spirits been doing today?

Post by Ian Bee »

Uneventful training yesterday with steady state stuff, but today was a vile return to sprinty land:
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For statistical pleasure, my 5k pace is 1:54.6 and 2k+5 would be 1:52.7, so I'm in for a spot of bother for next month's CTC :lol:
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Re: what training have free spirits been doing today?

Post by Iain »

Great training again Ian, similar HR at faster pace for the 4' and managed to beat all distances bar matching the last on the 2' (which looks a horrible session!). Just an LSD for me.

Tim Distnc Rate Split MaxHR % MinHR %
15:00 3,031 15 02:28.5 157 85.3% 098 53.3%
15:00 3,033 16 02:28.4 162 88.0% 155 84.2%
05:00 1,020 17 02:27.1 163 88.6% 159 86.4%
05:00 1,044 17 02:23.7 166 90.2% 161 87.5%
05:00 1,090 20 02:17.6 173 94.0% 165 89.7%
07:30 1,501 16 02:29.9 167 90.8% 158 85.9%
52:30 10714 16.3 2:27.0 173 94.0%

HR slowly coming down, particularly happy that it dropped off rapidly in the final steadier interval.
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Re: what training have free spirits been doing today?

Post by Ian Bee »

I feel pain at the though of that session Iain - 15spm.... :shock:

Straight forward steady state yesterday, but today:
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A bit frantic to shift between the pace targets. Those 4 minutes didn't feel particularly restful either.
I think my HRM was having an off day for the earlier session trace was appreciably more lumpy than today's.
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Re: what training have free spirits been doing today?

Post by Ian Bee »

10k training week, starting with:
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In my head, holding 1.55 pace seemed fine (yesterday anyway), and addition guidance suggested precious week's sessions should mean even holding 1.54....
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Surprised doesn't quite cover it, particularly with a reasonable 2k in the bag over the weekend. Even keeping 28spm seemed right.

I do not look forward to next time through.
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Re: what training have free spirits been doing today?

Post by Iain »

Ian, I have so low fitness at the moment that HR climbs fast if I maintain 17SPM! Hope to be able to do LSD's at 17SPM in 6 months or so, but keeping DF low (110) and trying to maintain a decent post while not using the excessive lean-back I am prone to when tired. Both your sessions look good to me. Coincidentally did my favourite session from Pete's 10k program Saturday, 4,3,2,1k with 4', 3' and 2' rest. He recommended starting at 10k and increasing by 1S per interval, but I start a bit slower and try and improve 2S / interval. Intended to start around 2:24, but found sub-2:20 felt right so:

Time: Dist'nc Rate Split MaxHR % MinHR %
18:29.9 4,000 19 02:18.7 167 90.8% 088 47.8% - much faster than intended, not sure that was a good adea!
13:35.4 3,000 21 02:15.9 175 95.1% 126 68.5% - feeling much tougher, but pace increased at end
09:00.2 2,000 22 02:15.0 177 96.2% 131 71.2% - H/D 550 in. Determined to neg split, really pushed last 500, amazed only 22 SPM
04:20.2 1,000 25 02:10.1 175 95.1% 137 74.5% - Trying to go sub 2:10, but took too much out in previous interval.
45:25.8 10000 20.7 2:16.3 177 96.2%

Happy with that despite H/D, recovered strongly. Today LSD:

Time: Dist'nce Rate Split MaxHR % MinHR %
15:00.0 3,020 15 02:29.0 150 81.5% 079 42.9%
15:00.0 3,020 14 02:29.0 155 84.2% 143 77.7%
15:00.0 3,027 15 02:28.7 156 84.8% 150 81.5%
15:00.0 3,176 18 02:21.7 167 90.8% 154 83.7%
15:00.0 3,028 16 02:28.6 163 88.6% 151 82.1%
1:15:00 15265 15.6 2:27.4 167 90.8%

pleased with low HR, looks like stroke volume starting to respond to training.
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Re: what training have free spirits been doing today?

Post by Ian Bee »

Iain - agree you're reaping the benefits =D> really strong finish to the 10k.
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Rather caught out by the absence of rests in this one - must read instructions - but happy with a solid cardio row.
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Re: what training have free spirits been doing today?

Post by Iain »

Well controlled row, well done by broadly maintaining the pace after reductions even in the second block. Did you try and maintain an HR Cap? I know that my HR would be way high on what would be at best an all out sessions (and probably ignominious failure) if I tried to maintain those stroke rates.

I would really like t build to an HM by the season end. At moment just training all around while trying to add volume progressively. But are there any sessions that you found helped to build confidence on sustainability and reasonable pace for an HM?
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Re: what training have free spirits been doing today?

Post by Ian Bee »

Thanks Iain.

I'm never completely conscious of HR rate to influence effort, but I'm increasingly happy with the reduced drift for these kind of sessions.

I was looking over my previous sessions, and the biggest shift I made was trying the Fletcher plan. It's fair to say it didn't completely work for me at the time - and with 20-20 hindsight arguably my technique got in the way and aversion to time on the seat - but the sessions do add up to constant managed cardio. Invariably 1hr-1:15hrs, 2 or 3 reps steady at marathon pace.
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Re: what training have free spirits been doing today?

Post by Ian Bee »

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Power at 20spm does not compute. Positives - better focus on spm overall and HR behaved.
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Re: what training have free spirits been doing today?

Post by hewitt »

Been quite and away from the forum for a while. Life has been a bit shitty and thrown a few curve balls at us. But being strong is what we do best. Jayne was diagnosed with breast cancer about 6 months ago. She has done all her chemo sessions and had one of her breasts removed about 3 weeks ago. And she is recovering well. So we are going to Llandudno this weekend for a break.
So while she has been off getting sick pay I have been doing double overtime so no chance of training in a gym.
I ordered myself a new erg which arrives tomorrow so I will be able to start training properly soon. Plus I may even get Jayne to fo some meters for her rehabilitation.
Sorry for the long winded post. :oops:
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Re: what training have free spirits been doing today?

Post by Iain »

Sorry to hear of Jayne's illness. Fingers crossed for a complete recovery.
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Re: what training have free spirits been doing today?

Post by bierik »

Steady 30min after a long day in the office. Goal was 7800m
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Re: what training have free spirits been doing today?

Post by plummy »

Sorry to hear of Jayne's illness - that must have been (and probably still is) really traumatic. Hopefully the shiny new erg will help with the convalescence/recovery.
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Re: what training have free spirits been doing today?

Post by Ian Bee »

hewitt wrote: Wed Mar 06, 2024 3:04 pm So we are going to Llandudno this weekend for a break.
Hope you both have a restorative break.
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Re: what training have free spirits been doing today?

Post by Iain »

Ian, much better min R20s. I never got on with Eddie's plans as my HR does not behave, so I either have to ignore the HR guidelines or compromise training (at present 80% HRMax is below 2:30), will see how it responds over the next month.

I focused on trying to develop some power, started small at DF135 and R30 with easier first stroke and rowing a stroke before the interval. 12 x 20" R30. THis is the first time I have failed to hit rate on one of this and did a 1/3 of the time!


Time: Dist Rat Split MaxHR % MinHR %
0:20.0 89 30 01:52.4 148 80.4% 116 63.0%
0:20.0 88 27 01:53.6 152 82.6% 123 66.8%
0:20.0 92 30 01:48.7 156 84.8% 122 66.3%
0:20.0 92 30 01:48.7 160 87.0% 126 68.5%
0:20.0 91 27 01:49.9 162 88.0% 128 69.6%
0:20.0 93 30 01:47.5 166 90.2% 128 69.6%
0:20.0 93 30 01:47.5 167 90.8% 132 71.7%
0:20.0 92 33 01:48.7 165 89.7% 133 72.3%
0:20.0 92 27 01:48.7 165 89.7% 133 72.3%
0:20.0 92 30 01:48.7 167 90.8% 133 72.3%
0:20.0 92 30 01:48.7 169 91.8% 137 74.5%
00:20.0 94 30 01:46.4 174 94.6% 142 77.2%
4:00 1099 29.5 1:49.2 174 94.6%

Clearly should have tried harder at start, difficult to go all out when being cautious of back! This was after a moderate 2k (trying to reduce 2kphobia) and finished with saw tooth cooldown.

Time: Dist'nc Rate Split MaxHR % MinHR %
08:39.8 2,000 25 02:10.0 168 91.3% 95 51.6%

05:00.0 1,207 26 02:04.3 175 95.1% 110 59.8%
05:00.0 1,021 18 02:26.9 165 89.7% 153 83.2%
05:00.0 1,145 22 02:11.0 176 95.7% 155 84.2%
05:00.0 1,025 17 02:26.3 166 90.2% 157 85.3%
05:00.0 1,092 20 02:17.4 173 94.0% 158 85.9%
05:00.0 1,050 18 02:22.9 170 92.4% 164 89.1%

Glad to go sub 2:10 at 90% without sprint and to see HR responding to 2:30 pace.
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Re: what training have free spirits been doing today?

Post by Ian Bee »

Iain wrote: Thu Mar 07, 2024 9:47 am Ian, much better min R20s. I never got on with Eddie's plans as my HR does not behave, so I either have to ignore the HR guidelines or compromise training (at present 80% HRMax is below 2:30), will see how it responds over the next month.
Know the feeling - was one of my issues with it. I know there are people out there that can follow maffetone but I just don't have the patience.....

Today:
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Having said I didn't like 20spm, like 18spm even less. Particularly with the increasing pace and no rest..
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I'm waiting for the day that I can finish this piece at target pace - a comedic 1:52.
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Re: what training have free spirits been doing today?

Post by Iain »

Ian, are you sure that isn't a typo? If the 2k PB is at 32SPM, that would be nearly a 50% increase in work per stroke. Also a 1S/4min increase would be 2k + 19 for penultimate (which you beat even with the pace drop off!)and maybe +17 for final 2 min. 2k + 17 would be about 13% increased work per stroke that seems more sensible. By the way, why did you do it in 3' intervals when increasing pace every 4'? Also it would be easier to interpret watts or pace as I for one pay no attention to Cal/hr! Also, after appearing to be working in interval 4, why did you jack up the pace so much on 5 & 6? It was never going to be maintainable, valiant effort to beat on 7, match on 8 and beat that on the average for 9 & 10.
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Re: what training have free spirits been doing today?

Post by hewitt »

Iain wrote: Wed Mar 06, 2024 4:46 pm Sorry to hear of Jayne's illness. Fingers crossed for a complete recovery.
Thank you Ian. :)
Ian Bee wrote: Wed Mar 06, 2024 8:18 pm
hewitt wrote: Wed Mar 06, 2024 3:04 pm So we are going to Llandudno this weekend for a break.
Hope you both have a restorative break.
We will definitely do our best to relax while she recovers from surgery. :)
plummy wrote: Wed Mar 06, 2024 6:16 pm Sorry to hear of Jayne's illness - that must have been (and probably still is) really traumatic. Hopefully the shiny new erg will help with the convalescence/recovery.
thanks for that Plummy. It was definitely a big shock at the beginning.
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Re: what training have free spirits been doing today?

Post by hewitt »

Well the new erg arrived this morning at 8.15am. 8)

Took the metal mistress for a test drive. Managed 3x1k with 2min rest at r18. The average was 2:04.6.
I could definitely feel the rowing muscles I have not used for 6 months. But once I have got myself used to rowing and mastered my technique again I will be aiming for over 8k every day. :fsbgrin:
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Re: what training have free spirits been doing today?

Post by Ian Bee »

Hi Iain, I would hazard lots of typos in John's rubric and yes - noticed the cal rather than pace:
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In all honesty I found it really hard to hit any specific target rather than simply 'go faster '.....
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Re: what training have free spirits been doing today?

Post by Iain »

Thanks Ian, just a slow row, but kept rating "up" to 17 SPM (I know that is not an issue for most, but I struggle to have a relaxed recovery above 16SPM).

Time: Dist'nc Rat Split MaxHR % MinHR %
15:00.0 3,053 17 02:27.4 149 81.0% 93 50.5%
15:00.0 3,054 17 02:27.3 154 83.7% 146 79.3%
15:00.0 3,058 17 02:27.2 156 84.8% 151 82.1%
15:00.0 3,189 19 02:21.1 170 92.4% 152 82.6%
1:00:00 12348 17.5 2:25.8 170 92.4%

Despite the HR spikes at the end of each interval (despite going generally slower), HR average 149 and kept below 85% max until I picked the pace up. I know that is much higher than recommended, but baby steps despite the higher rating and consequent increase in pace.
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Re: what training have free spirits been doing today?

Post by Ian Bee »

Nice row Iain - these sessions really make a difference.

Wrapping up the 10k week:
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HR monitor battery died but no sign of drift or raise for a bit more pace (a smidge ahead of target).
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Re: what training have free spirits been doing today?

Post by Claudius »

Congrats to all of the consistent Training. And especially for those who are in the restart process, Hewitt. May you have the benefits and numbers you need with the new metall mistress - and all the best to your spouse/friend with this kind of diagnosis.
Yesterdays first session was planned as a simple 10k slightly faster 2min split. Playing a game and focus on rowing sometimes do not match each other. So a jersey was taken which in some situations is regarded as a game-over sitution. Restart the 10k on Makuri, again with the redrobot, switched wifi off, and the redrobot was gone too quickly - but training evolved as planned - but without heartrate. If you pay good money for one of the best HR monitors (Polar-H10) then you should also invest in good batteries. The new one I replaced a week ago. It was a cheap one. Never buy cheap cr2025 - they are cheap because they are cheap. I just used the wrist HR of my Garmin 265 - it worked precisely enough to see a reasonable fluctuating HR 128-132/min. Unfortuantely on the c2rower one can not quickly change the HR source. That was yesterdays morning session. In the afternoon I did a road bike session with focus on climbing with low cadence and high force - something I just needed to do more...It was a great training. Today IDW - 2x 5k - both low intensity. Different approaches. First with a slightly higher Drag and a normal stroke rate correlating to pace of about 22. Second in contrast to yesterdays road bike training with lower drag and higher stroke rate- that is the IWD result. That was a small summary. Not some specialities. But consistent training.
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