Football teams and dreams
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- webberg
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Football teams and dreams
We seem not to have a place where those of us into football (soccer) can debate our well (or not) our teams are doing and controversial incidents.
With the World Cup in the US next year (hoping to go to a couple of games) it might be time for us Europeans/South Americans to bring our accumulated knowledge to the aid of the North Americans and others?
I support Southampton - have done since I was six years old.
We're not doing very well at the moment - bottom of the UK Premier League with no sign of improving that.
I have a son who coaches in the US - Maine - for Seacoast united. They are what we would call a talent spotting outfit grooming players for college and perhaps the MLS.
I think Portland Maine has a second division professional/semi pro team now.
You and yours?
With the World Cup in the US next year (hoping to go to a couple of games) it might be time for us Europeans/South Americans to bring our accumulated knowledge to the aid of the North Americans and others?
I support Southampton - have done since I was six years old.
We're not doing very well at the moment - bottom of the UK Premier League with no sign of improving that.
I have a son who coaches in the US - Maine - for Seacoast united. They are what we would call a talent spotting outfit grooming players for college and perhaps the MLS.
I think Portland Maine has a second division professional/semi pro team now.
You and yours?
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- fkoene
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Re: Football teams and dreams
Personally I'm a Feyenoord fan. One of the local Rotterdam based teams in our competition.
We've had a couple of okay seasons, with Arne Slot as coach, who's doing not that bad with Liverpool at the moment.
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We've had a couple of okay seasons, with Arne Slot as coach, who's doing not that bad with Liverpool at the moment.
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- Mike Channin
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Re: Football teams and dreams
As a Liverpool fan, I thank you for Arne Slot, who I suspect will become a legend like Klopp, Dalgleish and Shankly.
The man is an amazing coach, and is doing an unbelievable job so far!
The man is an amazing coach, and is doing an unbelievable job so far!

- webberg
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Re: Football teams and dreams
The UK Premier League is in reality three separate competitions in which the dividing criteria is money.
There are 6 (arguably 7) teams who dominate because they are prepared to breach the PSR (profit and sustainability rules) rules because they know that the PL and the FA dare not sanction them. Imagine the fury if Man City were to be docked enough points to relegate them or even demote them to the Championship or League 1? The PL and the FA would be mired in law suits for decades.
There are teams who would like to join the PL club but cannot perversely because of the PSR rules. Any promoted team plus perhaps those who are spending on new stadia would be here.
Then you have all the rest.
Realistically, the promoted teams each season are trying to be the best of the worst and stay long enough to become a middle ranking team. None of them have the financial clout to be a top 6 because that is an exclusive club owned by sovereign funds and multi billionaires.
I think the PL is a spent force.
I'd prefer to see the best UK teams (by football excellence and not balance sheet) play in a European super league and not play UK Premier League matches but instead be limited to say the FA cup.
I'd also like to see a salary cap similar to the US pro sports teams and perhaps even a max annual club spend. All this designed to make the league more competitive and welcoming and remove it from the preserve of billionaires.
Perverse that a game invented for and played by the "common man" is now so expensive that it is beyond their reach.
There are 6 (arguably 7) teams who dominate because they are prepared to breach the PSR (profit and sustainability rules) rules because they know that the PL and the FA dare not sanction them. Imagine the fury if Man City were to be docked enough points to relegate them or even demote them to the Championship or League 1? The PL and the FA would be mired in law suits for decades.
There are teams who would like to join the PL club but cannot perversely because of the PSR rules. Any promoted team plus perhaps those who are spending on new stadia would be here.
Then you have all the rest.
Realistically, the promoted teams each season are trying to be the best of the worst and stay long enough to become a middle ranking team. None of them have the financial clout to be a top 6 because that is an exclusive club owned by sovereign funds and multi billionaires.
I think the PL is a spent force.
I'd prefer to see the best UK teams (by football excellence and not balance sheet) play in a European super league and not play UK Premier League matches but instead be limited to say the FA cup.
I'd also like to see a salary cap similar to the US pro sports teams and perhaps even a max annual club spend. All this designed to make the league more competitive and welcoming and remove it from the preserve of billionaires.
Perverse that a game invented for and played by the "common man" is now so expensive that it is beyond their reach.
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- fkoene
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Re: Football teams and dreams
I don't think any Dutch teams could afford to play in a European Superleague. Not enough money to spend.
With that in mind I like the current competition, in which Feyenoord beat Bayern München last week. Albeit not completely deserved perhaps.
With a Superleague there wouldn't be these kind of matches for Feyenoord I think.
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With that in mind I like the current competition, in which Feyenoord beat Bayern München last week. Albeit not completely deserved perhaps.
With a Superleague there wouldn't be these kind of matches for Feyenoord I think.
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- webberg
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Re: Football teams and dreams
I think a Dutch team in a ESL would be a very attractive proposition for investment.
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- webberg
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Re: Football teams and dreams
I'm a Saints supporter and as such looking forward to life in the Championship next season where we might win a game.
In a season of unremitting misery we have one bright spark - the emergence of a teenager with great ability - Tyler Dibling.
He did leave Saints for Chelsea but didn't settle and saw no path to first team football and is back with us. He's started perhaps 15 games this season, has a few goals.
He looks a bit like a taller blonder and better looking Jack Gealish and his playing style is similar. He does however have a bit more energy and drive than Grealish.
(I've never been a fan of Grealish).
So, young (19), talented, first team player in the PL is a poor team destined to be relegated.
Does he stay or does he go this month or in the summer?
In a season of unremitting misery we have one bright spark - the emergence of a teenager with great ability - Tyler Dibling.
He did leave Saints for Chelsea but didn't settle and saw no path to first team football and is back with us. He's started perhaps 15 games this season, has a few goals.
He looks a bit like a taller blonder and better looking Jack Gealish and his playing style is similar. He does however have a bit more energy and drive than Grealish.
(I've never been a fan of Grealish).
So, young (19), talented, first team player in the PL is a poor team destined to be relegated.
Does he stay or does he go this month or in the summer?
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- Ian Bee
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Re: Football teams and dreams
webberg wrote: Wed Jan 29, 2025 5:54 pm I'm a Saints supporter and as such looking forward to life in the Championship next season where we might win a game.

There will be a clear out I'm sure. As a side note - I look fondly back to the days when I worked for Saints when they played at the Dell. Lots of fun - Graeme Souness providing hair drier treatment to the referee (or frankly anyone in his eyeline) and that grey shirt incident with Man U.....
- webberg
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Re: Football teams and dreams
I was at that game Ian. Great memories.
I was at Saints as a trainee (aged 14 to 18). I can remember being invited to The Dell by the club as a youngster and watching a game (forget which) from the "luxury" of the back of the director's box.
We (the under 15 squad) were told to wait in the box at the end of the match. Nothing much was said but we thought that might get introduced to the first team or something.
We were instead introduced to a paid of Marigolds (rubber gloves) and a plastic sack and spent the next hour picking up litter on the terraces.
The glamourous life of a wannabe footballer in the early 1970's!
I was at Saints as a trainee (aged 14 to 18). I can remember being invited to The Dell by the club as a youngster and watching a game (forget which) from the "luxury" of the back of the director's box.
We (the under 15 squad) were told to wait in the box at the end of the match. Nothing much was said but we thought that might get introduced to the first team or something.
We were instead introduced to a paid of Marigolds (rubber gloves) and a plastic sack and spent the next hour picking up litter on the terraces.
The glamourous life of a wannabe footballer in the early 1970's!
Uphill to the finish
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Re: Football teams and dreams
As a Birmingham City fan, I've had decades of mediocrity, doom and gloom, with the odd bit of sunshine now and then.
And low and behold, we now have fantastic owners, money, and a bright future. Certainly immediate future anyway.
As someone who has bemoaned the money side of the game, its a fact - the richest teams win, I do have some misgivings. But what the hell, I'm going to enjoy it!
And low and behold, we now have fantastic owners, money, and a bright future. Certainly immediate future anyway.
As someone who has bemoaned the money side of the game, its a fact - the richest teams win, I do have some misgivings. But what the hell, I'm going to enjoy it!
Wolfie

Age 59 Height 6'4" Weight 93k

Age 59 Height 6'4" Weight 93k
- Paul Victory
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Re: Football teams and dreams
Interesting thread webberg. As a long suffering Tottenham fan, I agree with your comments about money and the richest clubs circumventing the financial fair play rules. It’s unconscionable that Everton and Notts Forest received points deductions last season, while Man City have ridden roughshod over the rules for several years and are using an army of lawyers to make it almost impossible for the Premier League to impose any sanctions on them.
I don’t know if it’s 100% fair to tar all the other “rich” clubs with the same brush. Chelsea certainly have a lot of questions to answer, particularly during the Abramovich years, but there doesn’t seem to be a huge amount of evidence of similar abuses of the system by the other clubs. And Tottenham fans would argue that there has been far too much focus on the bottom line and not enough on footballing success over the past several years.
On that particular topic, the next few days are key for my beloved Spurs. If we can somehow scrape past Liverpool tomorrow and Aston Villa on Sunday, it will set things up nicely for the rest of the season. Of course, there’s always the spectre of possibly getting dragged into a prolonged struggle against relegation, but I like to delude myself that we’re far too good a team for that to happen.
I don’t know if it’s 100% fair to tar all the other “rich” clubs with the same brush. Chelsea certainly have a lot of questions to answer, particularly during the Abramovich years, but there doesn’t seem to be a huge amount of evidence of similar abuses of the system by the other clubs. And Tottenham fans would argue that there has been far too much focus on the bottom line and not enough on footballing success over the past several years.
On that particular topic, the next few days are key for my beloved Spurs. If we can somehow scrape past Liverpool tomorrow and Aston Villa on Sunday, it will set things up nicely for the rest of the season. Of course, there’s always the spectre of possibly getting dragged into a prolonged struggle against relegation, but I like to delude myself that we’re far too good a team for that to happen.
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- Mike Channin
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Re: Football teams and dreams
Hmm. Some of this I totally agree with, and some I suspect I don't, although it depends on which 6 or 7 teams you mean. I think I'm more in line with Paul V's views.webberg wrote: Tue Jan 28, 2025 10:21 am The UK Premier League is in reality three separate competitions in which the dividing criteria is money.
There are 6 (arguably 7) teams who dominate because they are prepared to breach the PSR (profit and sustainability rules) rules because they know that the PL and the FA dare not sanction them. Imagine the fury if Man City were to be docked enough points to relegate them or even demote them to the Championship or League 1? The PL and the FA would be mired in law suits for decades.
At the bad end, there is Mancheater City, who have founded an empire on blatantly cheating from 2009-2017; basically buying success at any cost, with no attempt to play by the financial rules. They are the Lance Armstrong of football, and probably should be expunged from the record books (as Armstrong was) and kicked out of the league (as Rangers were). This backdrop rather tarnishes any more recent successes as those were built on such dodgy foundations. If you remove them from the tables, the PL looks a lot more balanced and much less money oriented (although still far from 'fair').
They're not the first team to try to buy success. Chelsea have a long tradition of this, ever since a certain corrupt billionaire became involved, and the latest round of spending looks like they're playing to the letter of the current laws, while working totally against the spirit of them.
I feel like it goes all the way back to Blackburn in the 90's who were the first team to achieve success via massive expenditure.
Now, as a Liverpool fan, I'd like to believe our success was built on actually being good at the football side of things, backed by sustainable financial policies. That's certainly how the current owners present it. There are some big purchases at times, but also a lot of massive sales which help to fund them.
It pains me to say it (as a Liverpool fan), but I'm pretty sure that Arsenal have also achieved a lot of their success without buying it, too. Wenger was a genius for managing with meagre resources.
Sadly, the evidence is that the divides are getting worse, and the promotion/relegation bounce is getting almost assured, with maybe Forest being the only real recent outlier. And the way PSR has been applied has been brutal to some of the lower clubs, who ironically were possibly not the primary targets of the rules.There are teams who would like to join the PL club but cannot perversely because of the PSR rules. Any promoted team plus perhaps those who are spending on new stadia would be here.
Then you have all the rest.
Realistically, the promoted teams each season are trying to be the best of the worst and stay long enough to become a middle ranking team. None of them have the financial clout to be a top 6 because that is an exclusive club owned by sovereign funds and multi billionaires.
Too much money for this to be true. And it would be a shame as there are plenty of great games, and plenty of unlikely but well deserved success stories. And some really good football.I think the PL is a spent force.
The real question will be how far they dare punish Man City, or if dirty money will dominate over integrity and 'sport' once more.
It is a huge shame that football has become so money-dominated, but then this has become true of almost all global sport these days, and these days of sport-washing have only made it even worse.
I still think football can be a wonderful game, and this is arguably a golden age in a lot of ways, despite the downsides mentioned above...
Last edited by Mike Channin on Wed Feb 05, 2025 11:41 pm, edited 1 time in total.

- Paul Victory
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Re: Football teams and dreams
Very well put, Mike.
Although I’d be interested in knowing which 6 or 7 clubs you have in mind. I presume Man City, Man Utd, Liverpool, Arsenal and Chelsea are part of this group. In recent years, Tottenham have been part of the top 6, but clubs like Newcastle and Aston Villa have been nibbling around the edges more recently.
And, of course, you get the odd outlier like Leicester City in 2015/16 and Notts Forest this season.
Although I’d be interested in knowing which 6 or 7 clubs you have in mind. I presume Man City, Man Utd, Liverpool, Arsenal and Chelsea are part of this group. In recent years, Tottenham have been part of the top 6, but clubs like Newcastle and Aston Villa have been nibbling around the edges more recently.
And, of course, you get the odd outlier like Leicester City in 2015/16 and Notts Forest this season.
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- Mike Channin
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Re: Football teams and dreams
Great to hear Newcastle get into the League Cup Final tonight.
All the best for tomorrow Paul - may the best team prevail!
All the best for tomorrow Paul - may the best team prevail!

- Mike Channin
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Re: Football teams and dreams
Felt a bit sorry for Tottenham and Ange last night - they are missing so many players with injuries, and Liverpool never gave them a chance to get into it. I don't feel people should blame the manager, as there's only so much you can do, although I would not be surprised to see him get sacked as a scapegoat.
Brilliant result for Liverpool though and looking forward to Wembley.
Brilliant result for Liverpool though and looking forward to Wembley.

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Re: Football teams and dreams
Well done to Liverpool and I expect your team to win at least two if not three or four trophies this season.Mike Channin wrote: Fri Feb 07, 2025 9:48 am Felt a bit sorry for Tottenham and Ange last night - they are missing so many players with injuries, and Liverpool never gave them a chance to get into it. I don't feel people should blame the manager, as there's only so much you can do, although I would not be surprised to see him get sacked as a scapegoat.
Brilliant result for Liverpool though and looking forward to Wembley.
As you say, we’ve had a terrible time with injuries and I don’t blame Ange for last night or for other recent bad results. Having said that, some players don’t appear to be giving it their all and this needs to be addressed.
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- Mike Channin
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Re: Football teams and dreams
Gotta love the drama of the FA Cup. Well done Plymouth - well deserved winners today.
The defenders were outstanding; threw themselves at everything. Wonderful story for football.
The defenders were outstanding; threw themselves at everything. Wonderful story for football.
