Advice for the very unfit beginner

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Londoner
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Advice for the very unfit beginner

Post by Londoner »

I am very unfit, and have just bought a C2 because I would like to change that.

Reading the advice supposedly targeted at "Beginners" I have found, it appears rowers have a different idea of what is an "unfit beginner" than us lesser mortals, so let me start with some objective baselining.

I am male, 41 years old, 5'6" and I believe I weigh about 85kg. I haven't played any sports or engaged in any formal exercise for twenty years. Certainly, a 44" waist cannot be healthy for someone only 5'6". My Min HR is 74.

The basic advice from C2 for beginners talks of starting with a five minute warm-up followed by 30 minutes low-intensity workouts for the first couple of weeks. Well, I'm not sure there is such a thing as "low intensity" for someone in my condition.

The advice I've read says that one of the most common mistakes for beginners is starting with too high an intensity, and either being discouraged or injuring themselves (or both).

I've just done a five minute 'just row'. Meters covered 666, so 3m:49/500m. Average SPM:16 with drag 3. Not very impressive, I'm sure you'll agree. But it pushed my average heart rate to 143. After five minutes of resting and five of stretches, I then rowed 430m at a rate of 2:56/500m, and SPM: 17, so a bit higher power. That pushed my average heart rate to 157, which is into Zone 4 (and felt like it). Recovery to a resting heart rate of about 85-88 took over half an hour.

So being able to complete a 30 minute row as a "low intensity" activity is an aspiration for me.

Goal setting. While in the longer run I would like to be much fitter, lose weight and reduce my waistline, I need to be realistic. My short term goal is to reach a fitness level where I am capable of following the ordinary advice given out to beginners - without first injuring myself or becoming so dispirited the C2 ends up on Ebay.

I realise my situation is probably outside the experience of most of the people here (unless there are any fitness instructors around), but I would be very grateful for practical advice relevant to my own condition.

In the absence of advice, I'm guessing that 5 minutes a day, every day (or twice a day) until my HR recovery time comes down to something like ten minutes might be realistic, and then extending the duration gradually until I can match the C2 recommended "starting point". But will such a short duration exercise have any beneficial effect at all? If not, what would work better?
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Re: Advice for the very unfit beginner

Post by dr3do »

Londoner wrote:I am very unfit, and have just bought a C2 because I would like to change that. […]so let me start with some objective baselining.
This. Is. Great. ^O^ =D> 8)
I am male, 41 years old, 5'6" and I believe I weigh about 85kg. I haven't played any sports or engaged in any formal exercise for twenty years. Certainly, a 44" waist cannot be healthy for someone only 5'6". My Min HR is 74.
5'6" is about 171cm, right? That you already know you HRrest is great. What about maximum heart rate (HRmax), have you figured it out already? From that what you wrote about yourself, I assume you're not sick, just "not fit". You should be able to max out you HR within some minutes on the rower - just row "as fast as possible" for some minutes until you have the feeling that you're dying. Than stop to row that hard and just continue for some minutes of "gasping down". Remember (or let your heart rate watch do this job) the highest number you have seen. I generally prefer to (let) do the HRmax testing und controlled conditions as you never know what can go wrong - this is meant as security advise.
The basic advice from C2 for beginners talks of starting with a five minute warm-up followed by 30 minutes low-intensity workouts for the first couple of weeks. Well, I'm not sure there is such a thing as "low intensity" for someone in my condition.
To a certain degree I agree with you. Any sort of exercise will create the feeling of "high intensity". On the other hand… key to success will be to set the level of exercise to a level which you can sustain "painful comfortable".

The advice I've read says that one of the most common mistakes for beginners is starting with too high an intensity, and either being discouraged or injuring themselves (or both).
For 100%.

Most beginners a) increase intensity too early/fast (instead of increasing duration/volume), b) do not take enough recovery time and c) are inpatient (OK, returners are worse :mrgreen:).
I've just done a five minute 'just row'. Meters covered 666, so 3m:49/500m. Average SPM:16 with drag 3. Not very impressive, I'm sure you'll agree. But it pushed my average heart rate to 143. After five minutes of resting and five of stretches, I then rowed 430m at a rate of 2:56/500m, and SPM: 17, so a bit higher power. That pushed my average heart rate to 157, which is into Zone 4 (and felt like it). Recovery to a resting heart rate of about 85-88 took over half an hour.
Helpful numbers! ^O^
So being able to complete a 30 minute row as a "low intensity" activity is an aspiration for me.
Sounds good. From my point of view, you'll be able to do that quite soon.
Goal setting. While in the longer run I would like to be much fitter, lose weight and reduce my waistline, I need to be realistic. My short term goal is to reach a fitness level where I am capable of following the ordinary advice given out to beginners - without first injuring myself or becoming so dispirited the C2 ends up on Ebay.
I love your attitude. =D>
In the absence of advice, I'm guessing that 5 minutes a day, every day (or twice a day) until my HR recovery time comes down to something like ten minutes might be realistic, and then extending the duration gradually until I can match the C2 recommended "starting point". But will such a short duration exercise have any beneficial effect at all? If not, what would work better?
As I can't see (or: read between the lines) any "mental issues" doing an exercise, two times 5' a day is not purposeful for you. I would have ideas, but would need some additional informations from/about you.
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Re: Advice for the very unfit beginner

Post by strider77 »

Welcome to Free Spirits Londoner-you are in a good place to get advice :D

Boris makes some excellent points :D

My suggestion for what its worth would be to row around 3.00/500 pace and see if you can carry on a conversation or sing to yourself if there is no one around.

If you find yourself getting out of breath back off a tad but you MUST row for 15 mins.

Stop take your pulse or measure your HR and record it.

If you feel too tired the next day have a rest but if not jump on and aim for 16 mins and record HR and distance travelled all the time making sure that you are still able to talk or sing so not out of breath.

Add a minute every day.

It may seem boring but you will be rowing for 30 mins within 2 weeks give or take.

Blog your results here for extra motivation-we are a friendly bunch and really glad to have you aboard.

As a personal reference just under 8 years ago I went from 42 in waist and 108kg -I am 5ft 10 ins to 34 in waist and 88kg in 6 months using a similar regime -rowing every day will make you feel alive !!

(I have crept up to 90kg and 36 in waist but have kept my fitness level pretty much at the same level for 8 years)

Good luck :wink:
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Re: Advice for the very unfit beginner

Post by Liefcat »

Rowing can feel very hard for beginners - well, we have all been beginners at some point (and it is still hard :lol: )...

No, seriously - most people can see through rowing for 5 minutes. When you have rowed for 5 minutes a couple of times and feel up for it row for 10 minutes... When you can row for 10 minutes - you can decide what to do next... Maybe a 2000m if you haven´t already been doing one... :fssmile:
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Re: Advice for the very unfit beginner

Post by Rodger »

Welcome Londoner!
I think you're on the right track already - build up slowly, don't force it, stay motivated.

One thing I would add to previous comments is that in the first weeks, the pace per 500m is not a good indicator of your fitness. Your rowing technique and stroke efficiency will vastly improve and that will bring the pace/500m down quickly.

Be sure to let us know how you get on! :fsgrin:
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Londoner
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Re: Advice for the very unfit beginner

Post by Londoner »

First of all, thank you all for your replies. It's most encouraging and motivating to get some support.

Boris: No, I'm not sick, just suffering the effects of twenty years' of chronic laziness. According to the formula (207-(0.7*age)) my max heart rate is 179; I haven't measured it with a sprint yet.

Since both Boris and strider77 said 2*5mins/day would not be purposeful, I decided this morning to go for a longer session. Strider77, I'm afraid I really don't think I can manage 15 minutes just yet, so I elected to do 10 mins. Here's what happened.

I did a two minute warm-up at what I felt was low-intensity for me. In terms of effect on me, it moved me from a resting-on-couch heart rate of 85 to an average of 111. Is that a good HR differential for warm-up? (I feel sure effect on heart rate must be a better comparator across people of different fitness than speed, power or energy, but for what it's worth I only achieved 228m).

I then did the full set of six stretches from the C2 site (the one lying on your back is horrid!), immediately followed by a 10 minute row. Then stretches again to cool down.

Results:

Firstly, I was really noticing it by the three minute mark. I'm sure I would have quit at 5 mins if I had been "just seeing how I get on": clearly setting a target in advance is essential. Having mentally made a promise to Boris and Strider77 to do 10mins, I pushed through to complete it. So yay for me. :)

Secondly, HR. I hit 150 almost immediately and maintained that for two-three minutes. Then I went straight to 163, and stayed within the 160-165 range for the rest of the session. As I type it's over thirty mins later and my HR is 98, so still not fully recovered. Also, I felt a bit lightheaded (though not dangerously dizzy) during the post-session stretches - but not during the row. Unpacking a groceries delivery that arrived immediately afterward my arms were trembling a bit: is this the onset of lactic acidosis? Does it mean I'm over the anaerobic threshold? (163/179 is well into Zone 5, so I'm guessing yes). And if so, is that an appropriate way for me to start or not? (I'm concerned that may be a "No").

Thirdly, technique. I spotted that I was pulling the handle not to my sternum, but nearly into my throat. The reason seemed to be that with a fat belly and fat calves I was finding it hard to reach forward at the catch and was then hitting my stomach with an early finish, resulting in what felt like a very short drive length, so I was compensating by giving myself more room to pull with my arms. When I noticed that I was doing this I corrected it: I think the result probably coincided with the shift from a ~150HR to a 163HR. But it actually felt less strain on my heart and breathing, if more pressure on my hamstrings.

Oh, distance: in 10:07, 1487m. Right now though I don't care about scores. Trying to lengthen the sustainable exercise duration is the main goal. Is my HR of 163 too high to achieve that, or is it OK, do you think? If too high, how best to correct it?

Hoping that tomorrow I can do 10 mins again. Once again, thank you for your support.
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Re: Advice for the very unfit beginner

Post by Den-J »

Welcome to the best group using the best exercise machine :)
When I started rowing in 2008 I was looking for something to use in the winter I was mountain biking in the summer putting 2stones in weight on in the winter and spending half the summer losing it fluctuating between 13 and 15 stone 6 months later I weighed 11stone 8 so its great for weight loss
Firstly I would suggest going to the concept 2 web site and really studying the technique videos my first few rows pulling 2:25 pace was killing me, I just could not figure out how to row. I watched a couple of videos explaining how to do it and suddenly I was 20 seconds faster with less effort, when you said your arms were shaking it rings alarm bells you row with your legs! If you watch the videos and struggle to find the technique ( I did ) try lifting your heels high and at the start of the stroke drop the heels hard and keep the motion going it gives you the feel of engaging the legs, once you feel the power through the legs its much easier to reproduce the feeling (don't row like this though it's just a way to get the feel of a powerful stroke)
Once you get the basic stroke you will probably find it much easier to find a pace you can hold for the 15 min you are aiming for, at the moment you are almost certainly using your arms to much and as your legs are far more powerful they are exhausting your arms, no matter how much you slow you will always overpower your arms with your legs so watch the video concentrate on your legs doing the work and you should find it much easier
Let us know how you get on and we will take it from there
One more thing the advice I give to every one starting to exercise... commit to doing it for three months three months is not a long time but after three month take a look at how you feel I guarantee if you have stuck at it you will see a big improvement ..good luck
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Re: Advice for the very unfit beginner

Post by dr3do »

Londoner wrote:Boris: No, I'm not sick, just suffering the effects of twenty years' of chronic laziness. According to the formula (207-(0.7*age)) my max heart rate is 179; I haven't measured it with a sprint yet.
I personally don't know any person which really fits into the scheme of these formulas. Unfortunately these formulas aren't worth a penny for the individual human - each heart is/beats different(ly). E.g. my HRmax differs for rowerging, running, skierging, biking or swimming by up to 12 BPM. I had to adjust my "training zones" individually by sport.

I know, the HRmax thing will hurt, but please, do it. We'll then help you to define your training zones. :fsbgrin: You don't need to do that on a regular base, just once for the next month. It's really worth to know your combination of HRmax/HRmin.

On the day you do the max out thing you don't need to do any other workout as it's (hard/stressful) workout enough. ^O^
Since both Boris and strider77 said 2*5mins/day would not be purposeful, I decided this morning to go for a longer session. Strider77, I'm afraid I really don't think I can manage 15 minutes just yet, so I elected to do 10 mins. Here's what happened.
=D> ^O^ =D>
I feel sure effect on heart rate must be a better comparator across people of different fitness than speed, power or energy, but for what it's worth I only achieved 228m).
For you (at least in my opinion) heart rate is – for the next 1-3 month – a way more suitable marker/indicator than pace/power. But power/watts (in combination with your HR) will be important too… to chose correct pacing.
I then did the full set of six stretches from the C2 site (the one lying on your back is horrid!), immediately followed by a 10 minute row. Then stretches again to cool down.

Results:

Firstly, I was really noticing it by the three minute mark. I'm sure I would have quit at 5 mins if I had been "just seeing how I get on": clearly setting a target in advance is essential. Having mentally made a promise to Boris and Strider77 to do 10mins, I pushed through to complete it. So yay for me. :)
8) =D> \:D/
Secondly, HR. I hit 150 almost immediately and maintained that for two-three minutes. Then I went straight to 163, and stayed within the 160-165 range for the rest of the session. As I type it's over thirty mins later and my HR is 98, so still not fully recovered. Also, I felt a bit lightheaded (though not dangerously dizzy) during the post-session stretches - but not during the row. Unpacking a groceries delivery that arrived immediately afterward my arms were trembling a bit: is this the onset of lactic acidosis? Does it mean I'm over the anaerobic threshold? (163/179 is well into Zone 5, so I'm guessing yes). And if so, is that an appropriate way for me to start or not? (I'm concerned that may be a "No").
These numbers indicate me that you paced your session to fast (that's where power/watts are useful) from beginning on, in relation to your current fitness level. As you don't have any stamina, your will get exhausted very! fast and you HR will climb quite easy. You need to lower your pace/watts and stay there. Resist to erg too fast (for your level); this was too fast. Then it will be possible for you to do 2-4x 10' with a rest of 5' from beginning on.

Thirdly, technique. I spotted that I was pulling the handle not to my sternum, but nearly into my throat. The reason seemed to be that with a fat belly and fat calves I was finding it hard to reach forward at the catch and was then hitting my stomach with an early finish, resulting in what felt like a very short drive length, so I was compensating by giving myself more room to pull with my arms. When I noticed that I was doing this I corrected it: I think the result probably coincided with the shift from a ~150HR to a 163HR. But it actually felt less strain on my heart and breathing, if more pressure on my hamstrings.
I like it very much, that you're already aware about technique. This. is. great. 8)
Oh, distance: in 10:07, 1487m. Right now though I don't care about scores. Trying to lengthen the sustainable exercise duration is the main goal. Is my HR of 163 too high to achieve that, or is it OK, do you think? If too high, how best to correct it?

Hoping that tomorrow I can do 10 mins again. Once again, thank you for your support.
  • a) Please do the HRmax thing.
  • b) don't row every day. Row one day, rest next day.
  • c) pace low enough to stay within 55-70%HRR (this is "comfortable but painful" enough) for you
  • d) do 10' in one piece, rest for 5' (do some gentle! stretching, drink some water, relax and be proud of yourself), do another 10' in one piece, rest again for 5' (be more proud of yourself and fight your daemons :mrgreen: ), do another 10'. Stay within 55-70%HRR. Keep an eye on you HR, there will be a point where it will start/begin to raise - reduce pace and try to continue as long as possible, every minute counts. If you can't manage to keep HR down, you've reached the point of fatigue - then finish the session.
  • f) don't force it ("Rome was not built within a day") :roll:
  • g) please continue to post/share your thoughts, fears and your results/progress with us. 8) :fsbgrin:
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Re: Advice for the very unfit beginner

Post by gregsmith01748 »

Hi,

Welcome to indoor rowing and welcome to Free Spirits!

In some ways, you've already taken the hardest step by getting on the machine and starting. From here on out, you are going to make progress and get better. What was impossible in your first session will soon feel very easy.

I agree with all the advice given so far. The sooner you do a hr test to find your max, the better off you will be. The formula said mine should be below 170, and testing showed it was 185. If I set my workout zones based on the formula, I would have been endlessly frustrated. Boris is right, the test need not be fancy. Just do another 10' row, but every minute try to increase the rate and intensity until you can't push any harder. Then use that number as your max. You can repeat the test after you have been training for a month or so to see if you get different results.

The other advice I would give, and this is entirely optional, is to take a short video of yourself rowing and post a link to it here. Getting feedback on technique directly is much better than watching a video and trying to copy it. If you don't feel comfortable with that, then film yourself and watch it next to the technique videos or get a mirror positioned so you can see yourself.
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Re: Advice for the very unfit beginner

Post by strider77 »

Well done Londoner-you have taken the first steps to be a lean mean rowing machine =D> =D>

I agree with Boris and Greg you need to find your max HR on the rower-Greg's idea to do so is simple and effective.

Once you determine your max HR keep your rowing at 55-70%HR Max and no more for the first 4 months.

You should always be able to talk if you can not you are working too hard !

Good luck :wink:
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Re: Advice for the very unfit beginner

Post by sander »

All of the above advice is good. I suspect you will a lot from the technique videos.
Changing habits is difficult. You may want to establish a reward system. For example, for every 1000m rowed place a small but not insignificant amount of money on a special account for you to spend on something you really enjoy. The amount should be small enough to keep you going for at least three months, but big enough to feel that you are actually putting aside some money. Think of a nice and big reward after a few months. A charity donation?
Also, cross-train. Just add some other exercise on your non rowing days. Walk the stairs instead of taking the elevator. Walk instead of taking the car.
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Re: Advice for the very unfit beginner

Post by Londoner »

On Sunday I took dr3do's advice to do 10 minutes, five minute break, then another ten minutes.
Monday I rested.

Yesterday, I tried to measure HRMax by "sprinting": I managed to push HR to 180-181 before I simply ran out of puff.
I don't know whether this is truly HRMax: if it is, then my ordinary walking around HR is ~50-55% of max. Does that sound normal? Or at least, plausible for me?

Today I'm going to try for another 10min-5off-10min session. Tomorrow will necessarily be a rest day, as I will be away from home due to other commitments.
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Re: Advice for the very unfit beginner

Post by dr3do »

Londoner wrote:On Sunday I took dr3do's advice to do 10 minutes, five minute break, then another ten minutes.
Monday I rested.
20' at all. Well done! =D> 8) =D>
Yesterday, I tried to measure HRMax by "sprinting": I managed to push HR to 180-181 before I simply ran out of puff.
I don't know whether this is truly HRMax: if it is, then my ordinary walking around HR is ~50-55% of max. Does that sound normal? Or at least, plausible for me?
It's pretty fine how you did it. =D> Having about 55% at ordinary walking around fits well into numbers you have posted. Makes sense for me. In some month, if you do good training, many things will have changed in a good way. ^O^

You resting HR will change and/or vary day by day. You always can calculate your baseband with this tool: http://www.freespiritsrowing.com/conten ... /hr-bands/

For now you focus should be on UT2, which is actually in the range of about 138-152 bpm. Try to find the pace which brings and keeps you in this heart rate area.
Today I'm going to try for another 10min-5off-10min session.
If you find a pace which works suitable for you and keeps your heart rate in the lower area of 138-152 – around 140 – you could ry to add another 10' after a rest of 5'. What do you think, would that be worth a try? Or is this something you can't "imagine" for now?
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Re: Advice for the very unfit beginner

Post by gregsmith01748 »

Londoner: Thanks for taking the suggestions and doing a quick HRMax measurement. I think using 181 as your HRMax is totally fine. What I found during the first 6 months that I was training was that as my stamina increased and I started pushing my limits a bit more, I would see higher MaxHR. When that happened, I would recalculate my bands. The other thing that happened as I got fitter was that my resting HR decreased.

The MaxHR change was not because of increased fitness, but because I was pushing harder. The Resting HR change was definitely from improved fitness. I think you will see a significant shift in MinHR over the next few months and you probably want to measure it at least once a month. Again, if it changes, you should recalculate your training bands.

Also, I am impressed with your 10'+10'. You are really applying yourself to this endeavor and listening to advice. 8)
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Re: Advice for the very unfit beginner

Post by Londoner »

dr3do wrote: For now you focus should be on UT2, which is actually in the range of about 138-152 bpm. Try to find the pace which brings and keeps you in this heart rate area.
Did that. 10' at a HR of 140 (deliberately slowing when necessary to maintain it). 5' rest then 10' maintaining 145-147.
Symptoms: no dizziness this time. HR recovered faster too, but then it never climbed so high either. Was feeling some slight strain in my left arm (only), which suggests to me maybe I'm not pulling quite right.

Pace per 500m of 3:20 and 3:16 respectively. Compares with Sunday's 4:02 and 3:28, where the latter had my HR around 163. At this stage I'm putting it down to improved technique as I learn how to row properly, rather than to improved fitness; but that's still a win.
If you find a pace which works suitable for you and keeps your heart rate in the lower area of 138-152 – around 140 – you could ry to add another 10' after a rest of 5'. What do you think, would that be worth a try? Or is this something you can't "imagine" for now?
Maybe in a couple of weeks. [-o< Meanwhile, must try to keep this up. Again, your tips and advice most helpful and motivating.
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Re: Advice for the very unfit beginner

Post by dr3do »

Londoner wrote:Did that. 10' at a HR of 140 (deliberately slowing when necessary to maintain it). 5' rest then 10' maintaining 145-147.
Symptoms: no dizziness this time. HR recovered faster too, but then it never climbed so high either.
Great. Very well done. =D> ^O^ =D>
Was feeling some slight strain in my left arm (only), which suggests to me maybe I'm not pulling quite right. Pace per 500m of 3:20 and 3:16 respectively. Compares with Sunday's 4:02 and 3:28, where the latter had my HR around 163. At this stage I'm putting it down to improved technique as I learn how to row properly, rather than to improved fitness; but that's still a win.
At the beginning technique and timing is quite difficult. How to say that in english… RowErging has a steep learning curve. It's good that you're aware of small things like with your arm, try to watch some instructional videos and to memorize the sequencing mentally. That will help you.
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Re: Advice for the very unfit beginner

Post by dr3do »

Hey Londoner, how are you? Still on the way? :fsgrin:
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Re: Advice for the very unfit beginner

Post by colddrake »

I think this is the most appropriate thread for the questions I've thought of so far, although I don't think I'm *very* unfit… maybe I should dig out the heart monitor and find out.

I started rowing based on what one of the gym trainers told me, which had a lot of emphasis on 'don't go too far back or you'll injure your back' and not a lot else. After watching the Concept 2 videos and rowing c. 840km out into the digital Atlantic (I was rowing from Lochinver to Boston, but decided to head for my birthplace in western Canada), I've arrived at a style that's very comfortable but not particularly fast, at least by the PBs people are posting here :-) I'm averaging around 2:45 per 500m over +10k, but not a lot better for shorter distances, probably because a) I'm not trying hard and b) on shorter distance days (Mon and Wed) I've already cycled 55+ mins on the spinner. I don't know exactly what I'm wondering, but it's something along the lines of "What's a reasonable time/pace per 10k for a 58-year old, 162cm female relatively new rower?"

I'm averaging maybe 85 watts per stroke at 27-28 spm, which strikes me as more akin to what the video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eqVmMd7FdAA calls half-flight than full flight. This is with the damper at 10. I've recently started using the power output display on the rower, striving for a perfect upside-down 'U' with the damper at 6 - I can do it, but my legs hate me! This gives me 160+ watts per stroke, though, so clearly is effective in terms of power. I just need to work out how to do it more slowly so I can do it longer. I think :-)
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Re: Advice for the very unfit beginner

Post by Grobi »

Hi Sarah,
colddrake wrote:I don't know exactly what I'm wondering, but it's something along the lines of "What's a reasonable time/pace per 10k for a 58-year old, 162cm female relatively new rower?"
You can compare yourself to other rowers in the C2 online logbook, in the ranking section. Whenever you have done a ranking distance/time you can enter your result there and see how you're doing compared to others. So for example the average for lightweight women aged 50-59 over 10k is around 2:26 pace (http://log.concept2.com/rankings/2016/r ... 9&gender=F). Given your sportive background (cycling, hillwalking) I think you could easily do better than that.
colddrake wrote:I'm averaging maybe 85 watts per stroke at 27-28 spm, which strikes me as more akin to what the video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eqVmMd7FdAA calls half-flight than full flight. This is with the damper at 10. I've recently started using the power output display on the rower, striving for a perfect upside-down 'U' with the damper at 6 - I can do it, but my legs hate me! This gives me 160+ watts per stroke, though, so clearly is effective in terms of power. I just need to work out how to do it more slowly so I can do it longer. I think :-)
You could try a stroke rate restricted session with let's say 20 strokes/minute. This forces you to concentrate on technique and leg drive.

If you want you can post a video of your rowing technique here so people can comment on it. But concentrating on the power output is basically a good idea. First get your technique right (if necessary), the speed will come along automatically.
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Re: Advice for the very unfit beginner

Post by Liefcat »

colddrake wrote:
I'm averaging maybe 85 watts per stroke at 27-28 spm [...] This gives me 160+ watts per stroke [...]
I think I understand what you mean, Sarah, but that´s not a very precise description. A better indicator is the SPI (Stroke Power Index), in simple terms it´s Watts divided by Strokes Per Minute. A better explanation is found here: http://www.c2forum.com/viewtopic.php?t=38
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Re: Advice for the very unfit beginner

Post by colddrake »

yes, that makes sense! I've been 'just rowing', so haven't had any idea what statistics are useful - this morning was the first time I used the monitor for spm, rather than watts.
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Re: Advice for the very unfit beginner

Post by colddrake »

for example the average for lightweight women aged 50-59 over 10k is around 2:26 pace (http://log.concept2.com/rankings/2016/r ... 9&gender=F). Given your sportive background (cycling, hillwalking) I think you could easily do better than that.
heh. Courtesy demands I thank you for that suggestion, but I made an effort to do better this morning: the session was much less fun than usual!
You could try a stroke rate restricted session with let's say 20 strokes/minute. This forces you to concentrate on technique and leg drive.
This morning I did my Friday 10k spending the first 200-400m of each 1000m at, er, let's calculate: an SPI of 5.6-ish, then dropping to my usual 2.7-ish. That was hard and by my usual standards, I cheated: normally I pause for about 10 seconds every 15 minutes for a drink of water; this morning I could only manage the first 6k doing that, after which I needed a drink and a breather every 2k. But my pace was down to 2:40-ish, which is better.

I'd have to ask the gym trainer (or some other gym user who might not be able to spare the time) to video me, so I have to think about that. I'm also going to have to think about why I'm rowing; I started rowing to encourage a friend to exercise more and continued because I enjoy it. But trying to get my pace well below 2:40 will be hard work even if the achievements are satisfying: rowing will not be relaxing any more.
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Re: Advice for the very unfit beginner

Post by Liefcat »

Very good decision of you to take the low-rate in smaller, alternating bits, Sarah! And a 10k in itself can easily get hard, so well done getting through that and administrating your drinking breaks well :!: =D> =D>

You can see some videos that Plummy did for our last Madchester - last year - here: viewtopic.php?f=1&t=3040&start=125. One can easily get a bit self conscious doing that, but I think it was a good experience for all of us... :fswink:
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Re: Advice for the very unfit beginner

Post by gregsmith01748 »

colddrake wrote: I'm also going to have to think about why I'm rowing; I started rowing to encourage a friend to exercise more and continued because I enjoy it. But trying to get my pace well below 2:40 will be hard work even if the achievements are satisfying: rowing will not be relaxing any more.
I like the way you are thinking about this. Figure out why you are doing this and focus on that. You undoubtably get health benefits from rowing, and frankly, pace doesn't matter all that much unless you set objectives around it.

The only caveat that I would put on that is if there is an easy technique improvement that gives you more speed for the same effort, you probably should try to find it. The right technique will help you use all the right muscle groups and help to avoid repetitive stress injuries that can results from doing lots of meters in a way that puts too much load on any one area.
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