BRIC 2015

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Re: BRIC 2015

Post by dr3do »

Hey John, I don't know if you like hear anything from a "new one". :oops: :fsbgrin: From other conversations with you, I believe if you write…
Recess wrote:Any comments at all from anyone, would be very much appreciated.
…it's that what you mean.

Perspective and distance is difficult :-k , but what I see or believe to possibly see is…
It looks like main drive is not coming from your legs, but instead by leaning back too early. But when you lean back too early you don't have the power at the end (while your legs are fully extended, there's nothing more to come). And It looks like your right hand is higher than you left hand - that could bring some sort of muscular misbalance. Possibly you could lean more forward at the catch, as it looks like you have always some sort of "leaning back". Your ellbows could possibly go more behind your torso/back, so you could engage your latissimus more effective and wouldn't need to kink your wrist that much.

In the case I'm completely wrong and therefore wrote a lot of bullshit, you're free to buy some nice fresh stones. :mrgreen:

Again, I really don't want to offend you in any way. Possibly it's not a good idea to write… as I'm quite new to erging (and my technique is in my opinion still worth to work on very hard on it) . On the other side… I also hope to learn from your video and from the comments from other Free Spirits. ^O^ :fsbgrin:
Last edited by dr3do on Wed Feb 11, 2015 5:38 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Recess
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Re: BRIC 2015

Post by Recess »

Hahah, good link to YouTube!! Great advice too, I'll try to think about what's going on during each stroke, and visualise where the power is/should be coming from.

Any more comments, addictions, verifications would really help it seems!!

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Re: BRIC 2015

Post by CamiCrew »

John -- great job racing & so cool to see the video! Both of our :fsbgrin: :fsbgrin: !

Can I ask an off topic question... do you like tapatalk? Seems you use it to post here. My phone pops up occasionally and suggests I install it. I haven't decided if my phone is worth listening to on all matters, smart as it may think it is, so I'm asking you!

:?: p.s. Posting to FS from the phone browser is painful... and i have android not iPhone
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Re: BRIC 2015

Post by strider77 »

John I thought you looked pretty good mate certainly a whole lot better than my stroke =D>

I am not sure if the bearded guy was Tim Male.

Tim is an ex Olympian and a fanatastic rower, the bearded guy's stroke looked pretty good to me I reckon emulating him would bring dividends.

I also am certain your times would benefit from persevering with a lower DF than 180, but please feel free to ignore this advice.

One of the best lightweights I know who is also Scottish is Stuart Bizzarri he used to train quite abit at DF150 but always raced using DF 130 and he did not do so bad British Record LWT 45-47 at 6:30.7 !!!!
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Re: BRIC 2015

Post by Recess »

Haha, I must admit, I've dropped to df165 over the past month or so - my lower back was taking a battering from 180 - so I thought i'd back off a bit. I'll see what happens if I go a bit lower, maybe that'd help.

That said, I did just go to the gym and do just 4k at 24spm @ 1:50 - (df165) and I was bloomin' knackered by the end!! If nothing else, it's a different element of training.

AS to who was next to me, I'm pretty sure it was Tim. I didn't hang around for the medal presentations, but he did say he'd won and the result is here:

http://indoorchamps.britishrowing.org/e ... 39_LWT_MEN

Anyway, thanks for the advice.

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Re: BRIC 2015

Post by strider77 »

Tim did 6:07.2 back in 1997 as a LWT when he was in the 20-29 group so he is a World Class rower

I reckon without the beard and the extra drag he would have gone under 6:20 :wink:
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Re: BRIC 2015

Post by Recess »

CamiCrew wrote:John -- great job racing & so cool to see the video! Both of our :fsbgrin: :fsbgrin: !

Can I ask an off topic question... do you like tapatalk? Seems you use it to post here. My phone pops up occasionally and suggests I install it. I haven't decided if my phone is worth listening to on all matters, smart as it may think it is, so I'm asking you!

:?: p.s. Posting to FS from the phone browser is painful... and i have android not iPhone
To be honest, I only really use Tapatalk if I have media to upload. Apart from the problems Paul was having, it is a really easy way to upload images and videos.

Most of the time I click on Notification emails which open in a browser, so I tend only to use this for uploading stuff.

John


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Re: BRIC 2015

Post by Paul Victory »

Recess wrote:To be honest, I only really use Tapatalk if I have media to upload. Apart from the problems Paul was having, it is a really easy way to upload images and videos.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Hi John

When I tried to upload the video, I was connected to my home wifi. When I uploaded the video via WeTransfer, I was also connected to my home wifi and only 20% of the file had uploaded after about 40 minutes. I then went out to my home gym, which is just beyond range for my home wifi and the remaining 80% uploaded in less than two minutes via my 3G/4G connection.

So maybe the problem is that tapatalk is only configured to work with a 3G/4G connection and does not work with wifi? Or is that suggestion so ludicrous that it just demonstrates how little I know about how electronic communications work? :roll:

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Re: BRIC 2015

Post by mardix »

Paul Victory wrote:
When I tried to upload the video, I was connected to my home wifi. When I uploaded the video via WeTransfer, I was also connected to my home wifi and only 20% of the file had uploaded after about 40 minutes. I then went out to my home gym, which is just beyond range for my home wifi and the remaining 80% uploaded in less than two minutes via my 3G/4G connection.

So maybe the problem is that tapatalk is only configured to work with a 3G/4G connection and does not work with wifi? Or is that suggestion so ludicrous that it just demonstrates how little I know about how electronic communications work? :roll:

Paul V
Do you know what 'band' your wifi uses? It will look something like 802.11a, 802.11b, other letters may be g, n, ac. You should be able to see the information on a label somewhere on your wireless router.

Different bands work at different speeds. Also, you may have a weak wifi signal due to interference. The fact that you got some transfer on wifi means that the app was working on your wifi network, so the problem is most likely the network being slow or there is some form of signal interference - this wouldn't normally be a problem but you are trying to upload a large video file.

You can run a test to determine the speed of your wifi network here:

http://www.speedtest.net/

You should see a different speed for download and for upload - upload will be slower. Just go to the site when you're on your wifi network and click Begin Test.
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Re: BRIC 2015

Post by Paul Victory »

mardix wrote:You can run a test to determine the speed of your wifi network here:

http://www.speedtest.net/

You should see a different speed for download and for upload - upload will be slower. Just go to the site when you're on your wifi network and click Begin Test.
Thanks. I ran the test and my download speed was 6.09 Mbps, but my upload speed was only 0.35 Mbps. Would this explain the problems I had uploading the video and should I be getting on to my ISP to complain? They are supposed to be rolling out a super fast fibre optic service in the near future, but it's difficult to pin them down to an exact date.

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Re: BRIC 2015

Post by mardix »

Paul Victory wrote: Thanks. I ran the test and my download speed was 6.09 Mbps, but my upload speed was only 0.35 Mbps. Would this explain the problems I had uploading the video and should I be getting on to my ISP to complain? They are supposed to be rolling out a super fast fibre optic service in the near future, but it's difficult to pin them down to an exact date.

Paul V
Yeah, that's a pretty slow upload speed and would explain the problems you had- to give you an idea, mine is 10 Mbps download and 5 Mbps upload. Like I said, normally this isn't a problem because you probably never need to upload large files. Text takes no time at all and even pictures aren't so bad. Videos are particularly large.

It wouldn't hurt to call your ISP to find out if there's something you or they can do. Your download speed isn't bad so if you aren't generally seeing a problem posting things (uploading), then it may not be an issue.
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Re: BRIC 2015

Post by Recess »

That certainly explains the time it took to upload the file through Wetransfer, but doesn't quite explain what happened with Tapatalk. Maybe it just timed out because it was taking so long. although, didn't it say something about not accepting .mov files? Equally odd...

Speak to your ISP, but they tend to throttle uploads to defend against peer to peer networks. A bit of an old school approach, but it happens.

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Re: BRIC 2015

Post by mardix »

Recess wrote:That certainly explains the time it took to upload the file through Wetransfer, but doesn't quite explain what happened with Tapatalk. Maybe it just timed out because it was taking so long.
I would guess that either the app or the OS has a time out.
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Re: BRIC 2015

Post by Paul Victory »

Paul Victory wrote:
plummy wrote:Paul - from someone who's technique leaves a lot to be desired (er, that'll be me) - although you are a multi-Irish record holder, I see a couple of areas where you might be able to improve yours a tad (do you ever have problems with your elbows??)
I was thinking that myself as I looked at the video plummy. Two things in particular stood out for me - my stroke seems very jerky and my arms never straighten fully. I think my knees might be moving in and out a bit too.

To answer your question, yes, I do have problems with my elbows. My last injury related absence was while my physio was trying to treat the really painful golf elbow that I developed in my right elbow. He eventually allowed me to get back rowing when the extended absence from erging made no difference to the pain. I'm still doing exercises he gave me for my right elbow using a dynaband.

Any advice you can give me on technique would be very welcome.
I am keen to get advice on technique, so maybe I should ask some questions.

1. Do people agree with my comments above?

2. Is there anything further you would like to add?

3. Should I do another video (maybe from the side) so that people can see my technique close up?

4. Is there anyone that any of you would recommend who provides online advice based on viewing videos of people rowing?

Thanks
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Re: BRIC 2015

Post by Paul Victory »

I just came across this on Facebook. http://roworx.com/coaching/faster/

I'd be interested to know what people think.

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Re: BRIC 2015

Post by Iain »

Paul Victory wrote:Do people agree with my comments above?
I am the last person to provide advice, but straight arms are essential as arms are weaker than legs and you can't get the full leg drive without doubling the effort stopping your arm's straightening during the leg drive. That said, everyone's technique deteriorates at the end of a race, so it is worth posting a "normal" row for critique.

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Re: BRIC 2015

Post by dr3do »

Hey Paul,
Paul Victory wrote:I am keen to get advice on technique, so maybe I should ask some questions.
as John (@recess) asked, I took the plunge and wrote some words. Thought that maybe/hopefully other Free Sprits would write some better/additional points and we all could learn from "different points of knowledge" - but it didn't happen. :roll:
3. Should I do another video (maybe from the side) so that people can see my technique close up?
I watched the short, tiny and very shaky video of the end of a hard race. I find it too difficult to say anything. If you found my "observations/critique" for @Recess helpful, I would do same thing for you. :fsbgrin: So…
Iain wrote:That said, everyone's technique deteriorates at the end of a race, so it is worth posting a "normal" row for critique.
…we need a new video. :wink:

4. Is there anyone that any of you would recommend who provides online advice based on viewing videos of people rowing?
Possibly Xeno Müller?
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Re: BRIC 2015

Post by Rodger »

Paul Victory wrote:
Paul Victory wrote:
plummy wrote:Paul - from someone who's technique leaves a lot to be desired (er, that'll be me) - although you are a multi-Irish record holder, I see a couple of areas where you might be able to improve yours a tad (do you ever have problems with your elbows??)
I was thinking that myself as I looked at the video plummy. Two things in particular stood out for me - my stroke seems very jerky and my arms never straighten fully. I think my knees might be moving in and out a bit too.

To answer your question, yes, I do have problems with my elbows. My last injury related absence was while my physio was trying to treat the really painful golf elbow that I developed in my right elbow. He eventually allowed me to get back rowing when the extended absence from erging made no difference to the pain. I'm still doing exercises he gave me for my right elbow using a dynaband.

Any advice you can give me on technique would be very welcome.
I am keen to get advice on technique, so maybe I should ask some questions.

1. Do people agree with my comments above?

2. Is there anything further you would like to add?

3. Should I do another video (maybe from the side) so that people can see my technique close up?

4. Is there anyone that any of you would recommend who provides online advice based on viewing videos of people rowing?

Thanks
Paul
Okay Paul, you have asked for it.
First I think a frontal video is not ideal, as it's hard to judge the body positioning during the different phases of the stroke. But the way you keep your arms bent during the whole stroke is very clear. Also, at the finish of the stroke, it's like you flap your elbows out wide a bit. Then on the recovery, it seems to me you're bending your knees before the handle is past them.

All in all, I'm quite amazed that you are able to row as fast as you do with that technique (especially the bent arms). I'm not amazed that you seem to be somewhat injury prone.
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Re: BRIC 2015

Post by plummy »

Xeno charges for his services and I can't remember how much it was - maybe $50.00 a month or something like that for a certain amount of help. I've looked for my old correspondence but I think it's long gone.

I think Rodger is right in that you are faster than your technique should allow you to be but again that's not necessarily a bad thing as you should be able to move forward. From the front on view you look to be using your back very little but that may be because you have had some back issues in the past. The bent elbows and rocking to your left points to an imbalance somewhere which is quite distinct.

Madchester would be a good place for some critiquing of your technique - it's not too far away.

Lastly - I think all this technique talk is on the wrong thread - there must be one where it belongs more appropriately 8)
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Re: BRIC 2015

Post by CamiCrew »

You'll likely find Xeno's rate has more than tripled from that estimate. But don't quote me. :D He does good work, I've heard.
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Re: BRIC 2015

Post by Paul Victory »

The Xeno Muller stuff looks interesting, but some of the prices are eye watering. I think he's mainly aimed at kids hoping to get onto rowing teams at US colleges, but I see that he "guarantees" a 10 second improvement in 2k erg times if you follow his program for 30 days. Sounds almost too good to be true.

Anyway, I think I'll pass on that for now and I'll take a video of myself rowing at some stage over the next few days and I'll post it on a new thread. Some coaching at Madchester would also be good.
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Re: BRIC 2015

Post by dr3do »

Paul Victory wrote:The Xeno Muller stuff looks interesting, but some of the prices are eye watering.
Unfortunately I posted the link before realizing his prices… I'm sorry for that. :oops: (I couldn't and wouldn't pay that much for some "private use" as I'm not a professional rower)
Paul Victory wrote:Anyway, I think I'll pass on that for now and I'll take a video of myself rowing at some stage over the next few days and I'll post it on a new thread.
You take the plunge? Wow. Great, Paul. ^O^ ^O^ My hope is still, that we can do analyzes by our own, as we are and have a lot of good members.
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Re: BRIC 2015

Post by Recess »

Paul Victory wrote:I just came across this on Facebook. http://roworx.com/coaching/faster/

I'd be interested to know what people think.

Paul V
After looking back at how i performed at the BRIC's (trying to keep this thread linked to the original in a thin way) I've been thinking about this kind of thing too. I like the idea of what the guys at roworx are offering, but i wonder whether the $150 is not go to get the kind of return I'd hope for.

We can pick up a lot of training calendar advice online, so I think that part of it is just going to be specific to these guys - could be good, could be bad. But what I'd hope for is a cracking analysis of my stroke, then see the results working effectively.

I assume no-one has any experience with them? The video of the guy doing a 6:04 is quite impressive it must be said, but he's a big looking fella!

But, like Boris suggests, in the meantime, maybe we could start a thread in the meantime where we post videos (unless there's a server bandwidth issue doing that?) and others can comment.

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Re: BRIC 2015

Post by gregsmith01748 »

I started a thread for video analysis...viewtopic.php?f=7&t=3057

The only issue is that the youtube embedding does not work. You can still view the videos by posting the links in a viewer, but it's clunky.
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Re: BRIC 2015

Post by Paul Victory »

I know it may seem like an extreme form of masochism to revisit my debacle at BRIC, but I got the stroke data today.

As I suspected, it took almost 15 seconds for me to get started. :roll: #-o The stroke data showed that I had covered 0 meters after 14.4 seconds and 2.2 meters after 15.0 seconds. After I got up to full speed (which was 17.5 seconds into the race), I covered the next 301.1 meters in 58.4 seconds at an average pace of just under 1:37 per 500 meters. Hardly ideal pacing and small wonder that I slowed down after that, although I still feel I could have gone a bit faster if I hadn't lost a lot of motivation at that stage.

As I finished the race in 7:13.6, my actual time rowing was less than 7 minutes, despite the bad pacing, lactic acid bath and wrecked head. A huge missed opportunity (second place was 7:05.1) but a lesson learned (I hope).

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