Do any Free Spirits row on slides (or on a dynamic erg)

A forum for discussing training programmes, indoor racing, things that work for you, coaching etc.

Moderator: The forum police - (nee naw)

User avatar
gregsmith01748
Friend of the Free Spirits web site 2015
Friend of the Free Spirits web site 2015
Posts: 1194
Joined: Mon May 02, 2011 4:51 pm
I row on...: Model C with PM4
Location: Hopkinton, MA, USA

Do any Free Spirits row on slides (or on a dynamic erg)

Post by gregsmith01748 »

I bought a set of slides over the weekend (good bargain!) and I've been trying them out the past couple of days.

I'd be interested in comparing notes with anyone else that rows on slides or on a dynamic regularly.

The things that I have noticed.
- It is a lot more like rowing on the water
- The stroke is much more fluid because any herky jerky motions upset the flow of the machine
- It is much sweatier! On slides, the center of mass of the whole system (you plus the erg) stays roughly centered. That center of mass is right around where my butt is. So, my upper body is not swishing back and forth. Instead I am sitting in a cloud of my own sweat. I think a fan is really needed for rowing on slides.
- My steady state pace has slowed down by a lot (like by 5 seconds/500) perhaps this is just retraining myself with a different stroke dynamic, but my HR is much higher for a given pace than on a static machine
- My stroke rate is higher on slides. On an static erg, if I just start rowing, I settle in around r20. On slides, I settle around r25. I tried to slow down my rate today by doing a wolverine L4 workout at 18,20 and 22 spm and it was a killer trying to get my form right at these rates on slides
- So, the combination of slower splits and higher rates has radically reduced the amount of power I get out of each stroke. I routinely rowed 12 to 13 meters per stroke static for steady state. On slides, it's about 10m/stroke.

I'd be interested to hear if other folks have seen this, and if it gets better with practice, or if it might mean that I have some mechanical issues with my stroke.
Greg - Age: 53 H: 182cm W: 88Kg (should be 83Kg)
Image
Training blog: https://quantifiedrowing.wordpress.com/
sander
Free Spirit
Posts: 451
Joined: Fri Dec 03, 2010 10:07 am
I row on...: Model C with PM5
Location: Brno

Re: Do any Free Spirits row on slides (or on a dynamic erg)

Post by sander »

gregsmith01748 wrote:I bought a set of slides over the weekend (good bargain!) and I've been trying them out the past couple of days.

I'd be interested in comparing notes with anyone else that rows on slides or on a dynamic regularly.
I do. :D

We have 2 sets of slides on the rowing club and whenever I train there, I row on slides.
gregsmith01748 wrote:The things that I have noticed.
- It is a lot more like rowing on the water
Correct.
gregsmith01748 wrote:- The stroke is much more fluid because any herky jerky motions upset the flow of the machine
Haven't noticed that.
gregsmith01748 wrote:- It is much sweatier! On slides, the center of mass of the whole system (you plus the erg) stays roughly centered. That center of mass is right around where my butt is. So, my upper body is not swishing back and forth. Instead I am sitting in a cloud of my own sweat. I think a fan is really needed for rowing on slides.
Yes. I have been able to produce a steady stream (as in "opposed to drops") of sweat between the slide and the ground. But in my case that is also the difference between training in a warm rowing club gym vs an unheated basement at +4 degrees C.
gregsmith01748 wrote:- My steady state pace has slowed down by a lot (like by 5 seconds/500) perhaps this is just retraining myself with a different stroke dynamic, but my HR is much higher for a given pace than on a static machine
I do not recognize this. Actually, I notice faster or similar splits. Faster splits on the sprinty, high rate stuff. Perhaps the difference is that I am a LightWeight, but my intuition tells me that in that case the effect should be opposite. Of course I do row steady state at higher SPM on slides.
gregsmith01748 wrote:- My stroke rate is higher on slides. On an static erg, if I just start rowing, I settle in around r20. On slides, I settle around r25. I tried to slow down my rate today by doing a wolverine L4 workout at 18,20 and 22 spm and it was a killer trying to get my form right at these rates on slides
Correct. Perhaps for Wolverine L4 one should increase stroke rate by 2/minute at similar paces.
gregsmith01748 wrote:- So, the combination of slower splits and higher rates has radically reduced the amount of power I get out of each stroke. I routinely rowed 12 to 13 meters per stroke static for steady state. On slides, it's about 10m/stroke.

I'd be interested to hear if other folks have seen this, and if it gets better with practice, or if it might mean that I have some mechanical issues with my stroke.
Do you bump around? Do you bump around when you suddenly increase stroke rate going from rest to interval? If not, I would say you have no mechanical issues with your stroke.
Image

Training Blog: http://blog.rowsandall.com/
Free Data and Analysis. For Rowers. By Rowers: http://rowsandall.com
User avatar
gregsmith01748
Friend of the Free Spirits web site 2015
Friend of the Free Spirits web site 2015
Posts: 1194
Joined: Mon May 02, 2011 4:51 pm
I row on...: Model C with PM4
Location: Hopkinton, MA, USA

Re: Do any Free Spirits row on slides (or on a dynamic erg)

Post by gregsmith01748 »

sander wrote: Do you bump around? Do you bump around when you suddenly increase stroke rate going from rest to interval? If not, I would say you have no mechanical issues with your stroke.
No bumping around at all. At the start of the piece, I noticed that it works best to treat it exactly like being in a boat. I am resting at the finish, and then do a normal recovery and then drive. The first recovery draws the erg underneath me and then the first drive ends with the slides in the right place. I was in the habit on the erg of going to the catch, and then thinking things over before I started. Now I need to get thinking over with before I start my first recovery.

I was able to change rates smoothly without disturbing the machine.
Greg - Age: 53 H: 182cm W: 88Kg (should be 83Kg)
Image
Training blog: https://quantifiedrowing.wordpress.com/
dr3do
True Free Spirit
Posts: 645
Joined: Mon Nov 17, 2014 2:13 pm
I row on...: Model D with PM5
Location: Berne, Switzerland
Contact:

Re: Do any Free Spirits row on slides (or on a dynamic erg)

Post by dr3do »

gregsmith01748 wrote:I bought a set of slides over the weekend (good bargain!) and I've been trying them out the past couple of days.
Good bargain is very nice! :mrgreen:

- It is much sweatier! On slides, the center of mass of the whole system (you plus the erg) stays roughly centered.
That center of mass is right around where my butt is. So, my upper body is not swishing back and forth. Instead I am sitting in a cloud of my own sweat. I think a fan is really needed for rowing on slides.
Bahh. :shock:

Or a C-Breeze which even works on my Modell-D.

- My steady state pace has slowed down by a lot (like by 5 seconds/500) perhaps this is just retraining myself with a different stroke dynamic, but my HR is much higher for a given pace than on a static machine
Maybe you just need some time for adaption to the new movements?
User avatar
kirbyt
Dedicated and True Free Spirit
Posts: 1965
Joined: Wed May 02, 2007 4:13 am
I row on...: Model C with PM5
Location: Edmonton, Alberta

Re: Do any Free Spirits row on slides (or on a dynamic erg)

Post by kirbyt »

I probably would have already bought a pair but the footprint is too big for my erg room. I really like the look of The Oartec Slider but I've heard the monitor is terrible. I can hardly imagine how sweaty I'd be if it's worse than a static erg...a fast 10k on the static leaves me soaked.
54 years old probably around 77kg.
User avatar
gregsmith01748
Friend of the Free Spirits web site 2015
Friend of the Free Spirits web site 2015
Posts: 1194
Joined: Mon May 02, 2011 4:51 pm
I row on...: Model C with PM4
Location: Hopkinton, MA, USA

Re: Do any Free Spirits row on slides (or on a dynamic erg)

Post by gregsmith01748 »

I tried all the different options for at the head of the charles.

Oartech slider: smooth action, awful monitor

Water rower: all gimmick, but on the plus side it is endorsed by Xeno Muller and Josh Crosby and to top that had a prominent product placement in the american version of House of Cards :lol: It also makes a pleasant whooshing noise, not unlike the flushing of a toilet whilst being used. It is also a static erg.

Coffey sculling simulator: demanded a lot more proficiency than I could muster. I was all over the place on it. I imagine it would be a good tool, but only for OTW purposes. It also looks like a rube goldberg creation

Rowperfect: Amazing, delightful. Requires a PC to act as the monitor, but can emulate concept2 erg splits and give you a lot of other useful information. But you can't use it with RowPro or participate in Concept2 challenges and competitions with it. If you sleep in a bed of money, and are more interested in OTW emulation, this is the bomb!

C2 dynamic: Nearly as good as the rowperfect (but not quite). Very smooth action, small foot print, familiar monitor, works with rowpro. If I was buying a new machine, this is what I would buy.

C2 on Slides: Nearly as nice as the dynamic. The moving mass is larger than the rowperfect or the dynamic, both of which have a moving mass that is close to that of a racing single, so are quite accurate in the dynamic simulation of the rowing stroke. But if you have the room and you have an erg, this is the cheapest and most effective way to get into a dynamic.

None of this answers why you would want a dynamic in the first place. The basic reasons are to reduce the strain on your back (and neck, surprisingly) and to make rowing on an erg more like rowing in a boat.
Greg - Age: 53 H: 182cm W: 88Kg (should be 83Kg)
Image
Training blog: https://quantifiedrowing.wordpress.com/
User avatar
strider77
Free Spirit forever
Posts: 6157
Joined: Wed Dec 19, 2007 1:43 pm
I row on...: Model D with PM5
Location: Near Brighton

Re: Do any Free Spirits row on slides (or on a dynamic erg)

Post by strider77 »

Greg we used to have a C2 on Slides in the gym I go to years ago but it disappeared one day, I really liked it and preferred it to the static.

Glad you are enjoying it :D
[b]67 5ft 10ins tall, 80k, proud to be a Free Spirit[/b]
[img]https://tinyurl.com/fsrsigs/fssig-285.png[/img]
dr3do
True Free Spirit
Posts: 645
Joined: Mon Nov 17, 2014 2:13 pm
I row on...: Model D with PM5
Location: Berne, Switzerland
Contact:

Re: Do any Free Spirits row on slides (or on a dynamic erg)

Post by dr3do »

Greg,
gregsmith01748 wrote:C2 dynamic: Nearly as good as the rowperfect (but not quite). Very smooth action, small foot print, familiar monitor, works with rowpro. If I was buying a new machine, this is what I would buy.

C2 on Slides: Nearly as nice as the dynamic. The moving mass is larger than the rowperfect or the dynamic, both of which have a moving mass that is close to that of a racing single, so are quite accurate in the dynamic simulation of the rowing stroke. But if you have the room and you have an erg, this is the cheapest and most effective way to get into a dynamic.
We are considering about to buy a 2nd rower… so my girlfriend and I don't need to "manage one piece of equipment for two persons" and could even row together at same time. Concept2 (Switzerland) has some limited (as long as they have it on stock) offers for Modell D with PM3.

As I get really more and more committed/ambitious to/with rowing, I'm really thinking about a Dynamic as 2nd one (I guess it would be then mainly for me). I even (psssst, big secret) think about to do maybe a trial on water at a rowing club here in switzerland - but that would cost me a lot of overcoming because I not really like these swiss (their mentality and mine are very very different) and it's difficult to get an appointment (as trials are very limited/rare). ](*,)

My main concern with the Dynamic is… that it will be way too hot and that I'm going to transpire like a waterfall, because of no "direct fan". I bought very quickly the CBreeze, which works well on a Modell D – with open windows now it's cold enough :lol: to row without it. As I understand it won't work with a Dynamic, but on Modell D with Slides.

The costs (for D with PM3 and Slides or for a Dynamic) are quite identical, but I don't like the "grey" color of the Dynamic (no black available, like for the D). I don't know if our room would have enough length for a D with slides. Maybe one benefit of a Dynamic would be, that it has no chain and therefore be less noisy at least for "chainsaw sound", but it's maybe less durable then the "chainsaw constrction"… difficult. #-o :roll: :?:


Any opinion/advice?
dr3do
True Free Spirit
Posts: 645
Joined: Mon Nov 17, 2014 2:13 pm
I row on...: Model D with PM5
Location: Berne, Switzerland
Contact:

Re: Do any Free Spirits row on slides (or on a dynamic erg)

Post by dr3do »

I took the plunge and ordered… this Monday I'll fetch a Dynamic.
User avatar
gregsmith01748
Friend of the Free Spirits web site 2015
Friend of the Free Spirits web site 2015
Posts: 1194
Joined: Mon May 02, 2011 4:51 pm
I row on...: Model C with PM4
Location: Hopkinton, MA, USA

Re: Do any Free Spirits row on slides (or on a dynamic erg)

Post by gregsmith01748 »

Awesome. I think you will enjoy it. Make sure you buy a fan to go with it. :lol:
Greg - Age: 53 H: 182cm W: 88Kg (should be 83Kg)
Image
Training blog: https://quantifiedrowing.wordpress.com/
dr3do
True Free Spirit
Posts: 645
Joined: Mon Nov 17, 2014 2:13 pm
I row on...: Model D with PM5
Location: Berne, Switzerland
Contact:

Re: Do any Free Spirits row on slides (or on a dynamic erg)

Post by dr3do »

Hey Greg

Had to travel 3h by car… and got my Dynamic today. After lifting it (with some help) in the 2nd floor, setting it up I did a first row of 30' on it… It's a completely different thing. Huge difference. But I felt very comfortable with this smooth movement. \:D/

My first impressions (after 30' it realy only impressions) are… It needs way more awareness & concentration. At the moment I can't image doing a 2h session on it. My stroke rate was higher (22@165W compared to 16-17@165W). Did also a sprints at higher stroke rates (38-40) and had no issues with it – it felt very natural.

But :cry: I need to call Concept2 tomorrow… the NOISE. Unbelievable. My GF went out of the apartment and could hear the sound in the hallway (where all the main entrance doors to the apartments are). She was rowing on the D and the sound of the D was not to hear. Can't row like this in the apartment…
User avatar
gregsmith01748
Friend of the Free Spirits web site 2015
Friend of the Free Spirits web site 2015
Posts: 1194
Joined: Mon May 02, 2011 4:51 pm
I row on...: Model C with PM4
Location: Hopkinton, MA, USA

Re: Do any Free Spirits row on slides (or on a dynamic erg)

Post by gregsmith01748 »

I didn't realize that there was that much of a difference in the noise! I have only tried the dynamic at an outdoor concept2 tent at the Head of the Charles, so the noise wasn't noticeable at all.

I hope you can exchange it for a D with slides. Maybe you can buy two sets of slides and row with your GF in perfect harmony?

One thing about slides is you need a LOT of room. You need a big rectangle (3.4m x 1.2m) for them,and you can't really cheat that without hitting the stops.
Greg - Age: 53 H: 182cm W: 88Kg (should be 83Kg)
Image
Training blog: https://quantifiedrowing.wordpress.com/
dr3do
True Free Spirit
Posts: 645
Joined: Mon Nov 17, 2014 2:13 pm
I row on...: Model D with PM5
Location: Berne, Switzerland
Contact:

Re: Do any Free Spirits row on slides (or on a dynamic erg)

Post by dr3do »

gregsmith01748 wrote:I didn't realize that there was that much of a difference in the noise! I have only tried the dynamic at an outdoor concept2 tent at the Head of the Charles, so the noise wasn't noticeable at all.
First of all, it's not your fault at all. :fsbgrin: My hope [-o< is, that just something is not mounted correctly – because this could be fixed then. [-o< My Even my technique is far away from perfect, after ten minutes I really had the impression having found again an old old friend – difficult to describe, but maybe you know what I like to say.

The noise is not only loud, it sounds horrible, more sort of a "running power drill" which is turned on and off and on and off. :shock: Especially when pulling at higher wattage – at 320W my GF yelled to stop immediately. Could be the deflection system or maybe a role or something similar which is just not running smooth and thus creates vibrations while pulling… the cage acts as speaker then. I don't know exactly. Will call them tomorrow. [-o< Till then I try not to :cry:

I hope you can exchange it for a D with slides. Maybe you can buy two sets of slides and row with your GF in perfect harmony? One thing about slides is you need a LOT of room. You need a big rectangle (3.4m x 1.2m) for them,and you can't really cheat that without hitting the stops.
Nice idea. Unfortunately we really don't have the space - at least in this configuration. We would need to turn the rowing machines by 90°… this would "destroy" the whole room. We couldn't use the room for general training any more. #-o
dr3do
True Free Spirit
Posts: 645
Joined: Mon Nov 17, 2014 2:13 pm
I row on...: Model D with PM5
Location: Berne, Switzerland
Contact:

Re: Do any Free Spirits row on slides (or on a dynamic erg)

Post by dr3do »

Had my phone call C2 (Switzerland)…

I usually don't have the desire that someone makes mistake – except in this case. Unfortunately the device is not set up wrong, everything is correct/fine.

So, it's a very sad day for me. :cry:

After studying the Dynamic_MasterSchematic I now understand what does generate this huge noise level… The shuttle rail channel and the return mechanism box start to vibrate and act like a huge "body of resonance". Especially the return mechanism box is of quite of thin material.

In a normal room with walls you then get huge noise through reflecting echo – outdoors it wouldn't sound that loud.

I think it would be generally possible to reduce the noise by adding absorbing material on the inside. But for that both (the shuttle rail channel and the return mechanism box) would need to be adapted by factory/design.

The good news is… C2 (Switzerland) has been very benevolently. They will exchange it to a Modell D. ^O^ The black version is not on stock, but maybe next week, so I have to wait for that.


Sidenote: I measured the room, the long side has 3.36m, so maybe Slides will work?
dr3do
True Free Spirit
Posts: 645
Joined: Mon Nov 17, 2014 2:13 pm
I row on...: Model D with PM5
Location: Berne, Switzerland
Contact:

Re: Do any Free Spirits row on slides (or on a dynamic erg)

Post by dr3do »

C2 told me by e-mail that for the slides I would need 3.35m x 1.22m. The length I have is 3.36m… :mrgreen: =D> \:D/
User avatar
gregsmith01748
Friend of the Free Spirits web site 2015
Friend of the Free Spirits web site 2015
Posts: 1194
Joined: Mon May 02, 2011 4:51 pm
I row on...: Model C with PM4
Location: Hopkinton, MA, USA

Re: Do any Free Spirits row on slides (or on a dynamic erg)

Post by gregsmith01748 »

It's a shame it is so loud. But I'm glad that they will exchange it for you. Another example of excellent customer support.

You might want to contact C2 in the US to double check the conclusions. On the Concept 2 bulletin board in the US, here: http://www.c2forum.com/index.php there is guy from concept "c2jonw" who has been really helpful. You might want to send him a PM on that forum.
Greg - Age: 53 H: 182cm W: 88Kg (should be 83Kg)
Image
Training blog: https://quantifiedrowing.wordpress.com/
dr3do
True Free Spirit
Posts: 645
Joined: Mon Nov 17, 2014 2:13 pm
I row on...: Model D with PM5
Location: Berne, Switzerland
Contact:

Re: Do any Free Spirits row on slides (or on a dynamic erg)

Post by dr3do »

gregsmith01748 wrote:It's a shame it is so loud.
Yeah. :-({|=
But I'm glad that they will exchange it for you. Another example of excellent customer support.
It was really no point of discussion. I explained my problem. Within seconds, where the representative of C2 realized that the noise is a real bummer for me, he offered me to exchange it. THIS is really awesome, exceptional and amazing. =D>
dr3do
True Free Spirit
Posts: 645
Joined: Mon Nov 17, 2014 2:13 pm
I row on...: Model D with PM5
Location: Berne, Switzerland
Contact:

Re: Do any Free Spirits row on slides (or on a dynamic erg)

Post by dr3do »

Got yesterday the Modell D, but slides are on backorder… end of month I'll get them.

Picture 1: The right one will be then with slides
Picture 2: Different point of view.
dr3do
True Free Spirit
Posts: 645
Joined: Mon Nov 17, 2014 2:13 pm
I row on...: Model D with PM5
Location: Berne, Switzerland
Contact:

Re: Do any Free Spirits row on slides (or on a dynamic erg)

Post by dr3do »

My slides arrived right now. \:D/
sander
Free Spirit
Posts: 451
Joined: Fri Dec 03, 2010 10:07 am
I row on...: Model C with PM5
Location: Brno

Re: Do any Free Spirits row on slides (or on a dynamic erg)

Post by sander »

dr3do wrote:My slides arrived right now. \:D/
Congrats!
Image

Training Blog: http://blog.rowsandall.com/
Free Data and Analysis. For Rowers. By Rowers: http://rowsandall.com
dr3do
True Free Spirit
Posts: 645
Joined: Mon Nov 17, 2014 2:13 pm
I row on...: Model D with PM5
Location: Berne, Switzerland
Contact:

Re: Do any Free Spirits row on slides (or on a dynamic erg)

Post by dr3do »

Some feedback after 4 hours on slides…

Slides are not that "sprinty", compared to the Dynamic, but definitely more "sprinty" than the stationary erg is. On the stationary I can't row with high SPM's (everything higher than 25-26 is horrible for me). On my one day intermezzo with the Dynamic 38-45 SPM was no problem at all - it even aroused me to high SPM's. The first few strokes on Slides are way more difficult, than on Dynamic - it's very easy to "bounce". But after these first few strokes it's very nice. On stationery erg - well, there I have made most meters - my curve looks best. On dynamic it was by far not that good, but better than on Slides. On Slides I have to be very careful, otherwise I get some sort of lower back pain. :-k The Slides itself do not run that smooth, it's a big difference to the Dynamic - on the other hand, a fresh Modell D needs some million meters too, to be "run in". It's very handy that it's possible to take the Slides aways within 1-2' - that makes this combo very versatile.

Summary: Good buy. It shows me merciless that I have technically to improve. On static erg I felt like a novice with good amount of routine. On Slides I feel now like Beginner with no experience at all. Hard. :mrgreen: But it's a great challenge. 8)
User avatar
mardix
Friend of the Free Spirits web site 2015
Friend of the Free Spirits web site 2015
Posts: 111
Joined: Sat Feb 07, 2015 10:14 pm
I row on...: Model D with PM3
Location: New York

Re: Do any Free Spirits row on slides (or on a dynamic erg)

Post by mardix »

gregsmith01748 wrote:None of this answers why you would want a dynamic in the first place. The basic reasons are to reduce the strain on your back (and neck, surprisingly) and to make rowing on an erg more like rowing in a boat.
Did someone say reduced strain on the back? [-o<

Would this apply to the slides as well as the dynamic? I'll gladly pay a few sheckels for potential back relief.
Pain is inevitable. Suffering is optional.
dr3do
True Free Spirit
Posts: 645
Joined: Mon Nov 17, 2014 2:13 pm
I row on...: Model D with PM5
Location: Berne, Switzerland
Contact:

Re: Do any Free Spirits row on slides (or on a dynamic erg)

Post by dr3do »

Hey Mardix, I probably could reply and give some statement, but I think it's worth to wait if/till Greg will answer this, as he's way more experienced than me and you get a "higher quality"reply" from him.
User avatar
mardix
Friend of the Free Spirits web site 2015
Friend of the Free Spirits web site 2015
Posts: 111
Joined: Sat Feb 07, 2015 10:14 pm
I row on...: Model D with PM3
Location: New York

Re: Do any Free Spirits row on slides (or on a dynamic erg)

Post by mardix »

dr3do wrote:Hey Mardix, I probably could reply and give some statement, but I think it's worth to wait if/till Greg will answer this, as he's way more experienced than me and you get a "higher quality"reply" from him.
So the slides bring up several questions:

1. If there is back relief, then is the difference significant? If it's marginal relief then I may not bother.

2. Do the bungees that make up the slides become overly taught through the motion? If so, then I wonder if they would start to lose their elasticity/sag after a little while.

3. For those who compete, how would you deal with the switch from slides in training to no slides in competition?
Pain is inevitable. Suffering is optional.
User avatar
gregsmith01748
Friend of the Free Spirits web site 2015
Friend of the Free Spirits web site 2015
Posts: 1194
Joined: Mon May 02, 2011 4:51 pm
I row on...: Model C with PM4
Location: Hopkinton, MA, USA

Re: Do any Free Spirits row on slides (or on a dynamic erg)

Post by gregsmith01748 »

mardix wrote:
dr3do wrote:Hey Mardix, I probably could reply and give some statement, but I think it's worth to wait if/till Greg will answer this, as he's way more experienced than me and you get a "higher quality"reply" from him.
So the slides bring up several questions:

1. If there is back relief, then is the difference significant? If it's marginal relief then I may not bother.

2. Do the bungees that make up the slides become overly taught through the motion? If so, then I wonder if they would start to lose their elasticity/sag after a little while.

3. For those who compete, how would you deal with the switch from slides in training to no slides in competition?
I can't promise a high quality reply, but I'll tell you what I noticed.

Like Boris, I agree that slides punish technical flaws in your stroke. When I started with them, I found that my pace/power was about 20 watts (4sec per 500) slower for the same level of effort, measured by heart rate. Over the past couple months that has gotten much better, and I find I maintain that form on the static erg when I row at home without slides. So, slides are a really good thing if you row on the water, ever.

As for strain on the back, I think they definitely help there too. The way to think of this is to compare the amount of mass that is moving. On a static erg, your entire body weight, well, except for your feet and calves, are moving. For me, that's probably 170 pounds from the knees up. On slides, the erg is moving, and it weighs about 50 pounds. That's more than three times less mass changing direction twice in each stroke. All of that direction change is absorbed by the hinge in your lower back.

Now, I notice my back feels a lot happier after a slide session than after a static session.

As for the bungees. The tension on them is critical. I bought my pair used, and the bungees were shot. It was unrowable. I was constantly banging into the ends. I ordered the bungee kit, but also popped out to an outdoor store and bought the smallest diameter shock cord that they had. It was about 1/3 larger diameter. This was definitely rowable, but I could feel the erg pushing back against the foot stops with considerable vigor. When I got the official bungees, and tensioned them per the instructions, it was like "buttah ". So smooth and deliciously glidey. I am not sure how long they will last, but I bet I get a couple of seasons out of them and then replacing them is cheap and easy.

Regarding slides in practice versus no slides in competition. I don't have direct experience. The guys that I know who row on slides typically take them off for a couple of weeks to a month before their biggest race, at least for the intense interval work. That's actually the biggest advantage of slides versus dynamic, you can go back and forth in a minute as Boris pointed out.

If you value your back and you have the space for them (big footprint!), you should buy the slides.
Greg - Age: 53 H: 182cm W: 88Kg (should be 83Kg)
Image
Training blog: https://quantifiedrowing.wordpress.com/
Post Reply