Free Spirits CTC Participation and Leaderboard

The forum for general banter about the team.

Moderator: The forum police - (nee naw)

Post Reply
User avatar
gregsmith01748
Friend of the Free Spirits web site 2015
Friend of the Free Spirits web site 2015
Posts: 1194
Joined: Mon May 02, 2011 4:51 pm
I row on...: Model C with PM4
Location: Hopkinton, MA, USA

Re: Free Spirits CTC Participation and Leaderboard

Post by gregsmith01748 »

I think there are two things going on and they need different strategies.

The first is that new rowers need additional orientation to understand all the fun things that they can be doing as members of the team. I think the How To threads could help this, as could some kind of a "Welcome to the Free Spirits" membership package which could include all the getting started stuff. This could also be a way to instill team spirit and generate a bit of revenue by pitching Free Spirit logo wear right at the point where someone decides that they want to be on an indoor rowing team. Basically, it would make joining more of an event and a little special.

The second is the level of participation by existing members. As Stan points out, this is not a case of lacking the knowledge to join an activity, but is either a conscious decision to not take part in a specific activity by choice, some kind of specific reason that is a disincentive to participate or just apathy. I'm not as sure what to do about this, and since I am a "seasonal" member, I certainly don't have a high horse to mount. I am cool with the idea of everyone making their own choices about degree of participation, but I do think that it is more fun to have more folks doing more activities.

One specific thing on the CTC that I wish we could come up with a solution for was jokingly alluded to in an earlier post. It is somewhat of a disincentive to do the CTC as a Male HWT since you will either be sitting on the shore (or bumping another male HWT into a beached boat) because of an acute lack of MLWT and female rowers. If anyone has ideas to fix that problem, I think it might help out a bit.
Greg - Age: 53 H: 182cm W: 88Kg (should be 83Kg)
Image
Training blog: https://quantifiedrowing.wordpress.com/
Rodger
Best Friend (PayPal Subscriber)
Best Friend (PayPal Subscriber)
Posts: 1084
Joined: Mon Feb 20, 2012 1:55 am
I row on...: Model C with PM3
Location: Venlo, Netherlands

Re: Free Spirits CTC Participation and Leaderboard

Post by Rodger »

I like the idea of compiling a list of 'what's what in indoor rowing' or 'the Free Spirits ABC of indoor rowing' and put it somewhere central on the website. We could start by making a thread where everyone can add entries. I would be happy to contribute, even though English is not my first language - you're not alone Boris. :D

In the past there have been attempts to stimulate participation in a variety of challenges. This page on the website is a remains:
http://www.freespiritsrowing.com/conten ... arch-2013/
Perhaps we could (again) make this a monthly item but send it out as an email to all members? Or is that too much?
M | 48 | 1.78 m | 76 kg
Image
dr3do
True Free Spirit
Posts: 645
Joined: Mon Nov 17, 2014 2:13 pm
I row on...: Model D with PM5
Location: Berne, Switzerland
Contact:

Re: Free Spirits CTC Participation and Leaderboard

Post by dr3do »

Rodger wrote:even though English is not my first language - you're not alone Boris. :D
But you're from the Netherlands (I know the difference between Netherlands and Dutch :lol: BTW: Sounds great!). Your english is quite good! I'm born in Poland, partially grew up in Africa and came as child then to Germany. In school then english… and latin (WTF!). It's quite confusing in my mind with all these languages and different grammar styles. :mrgreen: So German became my main language. Polish died nearly completely (due to need/exercise). French still works (but only spoken word). And english I understand far better than I'm able to write/speak.
sander
Free Spirit
Posts: 451
Joined: Fri Dec 03, 2010 10:07 am
I row on...: Model C with PM5
Location: Brno

Re: Free Spirits CTC Participation and Leaderboard

Post by sander »

gregsmith01748 wrote:I guess I need some advice. I want to be a supportive team mate, but I am not all that focused on erg based training for nearly 8 months a year. I haven't been putting in CTC scores because they would be pretty bad relative to where I get during the erg season.

If folks value participation, I'd be happy to plug in a 95% effort. I just don't want to change my training objectives to really put my best effort into the CTC.

What do you all think? I don't want to be looked at as a deadbeat member.
Greg, I am the same. When I do the CTC I have to substitute one of my trainings. In some months this is very hard to do, and I end up doing a 90-95% effort. I usually have only one shot at a CTC per month.

But as a MLWT, I usually end up in some boat, and have actually never stood on the shore. :fsbgrin:

Of course, if more of the CTCs would be a straight 1k, 2k, 5k, 6k or 10k effort, I would put in more effort as they would coincide with what I consider my standard test distances. I guess they are for most of us using the signature table.
Image

Training Blog: http://blog.rowsandall.com/
Free Data and Analysis. For Rowers. By Rowers: http://rowsandall.com
User avatar
Recess
Friend of the Free Spirits web site 2015
Friend of the Free Spirits web site 2015
Posts: 668
Joined: Mon Oct 14, 2013 1:35 pm
I row on...: Model D with PM5
Location: Glasgow
Contact:

Re: Free Spirits CTC Participation and Leaderboard

Post by Recess »

That's a good point actually. I know the reason Julie is reluctant to do it every month is that it's too complicated - she just wants to climb on, row, stop. All the intervals, though actually beneficial depending on where you're at in a training cycle, can be off putting to those who just want to log-on and sweat!

John
It's not how far you go... It's how go you far.
Image

Follow my training blog as I try to break a world record: http://johntherower.com
User avatar
kirbyt
Dedicated and True Free Spirit
Posts: 1965
Joined: Wed May 02, 2007 4:13 am
I row on...: Model C with PM5
Location: Edmonton, Alberta

Re: Free Spirits CTC Participation and Leaderboard

Post by kirbyt »

Sander said:
Of course, if more of the CTCs would be a straight 1k, 2k, 5k, 6k or 10k effort, I would put in more effort as they would coincide with what I consider my standard test distances. I guess they are for most of us using the signature table.
Exactly. When the ctc is some weird interval beast with super short rests I find it difficult to fit into my training and frankly rather dreadful to complete. I guess as long as the powers that be think that each challenge has to be something new, terrifying and confusing we'll keep seeing these things. Every time there is a nice straightforward challenge like a 5k some people complain that it's boring.
54 years old probably around 77kg.
Rodger
Best Friend (PayPal Subscriber)
Best Friend (PayPal Subscriber)
Posts: 1084
Joined: Mon Feb 20, 2012 1:55 am
I row on...: Model C with PM3
Location: Venlo, Netherlands

Re: Free Spirits CTC Participation and Leaderboard

Post by Rodger »

It's certainly true that FS partcipation is higher when the challenge is a single distance than when it's complicated intervals or rate restricted stuff. The three most successful in 2013-2014 were:
Oct 2013 - 3861m (FS choice for Gaye McOnie): 70.
Feb 2013 - 30 min: 62.
Jan 2014 - 5k: 53.
M | 48 | 1.78 m | 76 kg
Image
User avatar
Paul Victory
Friend of the Free Spirits web site 2016
Friend of the Free Spirits web site 2016
Posts: 10616
Joined: Mon Jul 10, 2006 9:29 pm
I row on...: Model E with PM4
Location: Dublin

Re: Free Spirits CTC Participation and Leaderboard

Post by Paul Victory »

I think one of the reasons why fewer people attempt the interval challenges is the difficulty of setting up intervals in a gym and in holding onto the erg during the rest intervals. There's also a problem with PM2s, which are not able to do mixed intervals. Of course, they're also extremely painful (if done properly) and I know I avoided them when I was going through my less active phase between Spring 2012 and Winter 2013.
M 68 6'1" 124kg (May05), 92kg (Feb06), 122kg (Aug10), 95kg (Sep11), 117kg (Jun13), now 98kg
Image
User avatar
Jill
Friend of the Free Spirits web site 2020
Friend of the Free Spirits web site 2020
Posts: 1970
Joined: Sun Jun 01, 2014 1:37 pm
I row on...: Model E with PM5

Re: Free Spirits CTC Participation and Leaderboard

Post by Jill »

plummy wrote:I think anything that helps participation is to be welcomed - but - the nub of the issue is finding out if people out there are not taking part because the they simply don't know about the various challenges/how to join etc - or are basically just happy to be a name on the metreboard and have no interest in anything else outside that.
If the latter is the case then no amount of additional info is going to make a difference.

Then we have secondary quandary that if there are a sizeable majority who only want to be a name on the metreboard (and by default never look in on the forum etc) - how can we even ask the question of them because they'll never see it!
Plummy - out of curiosity, I've just read this and most of the November CTC thread. Some very valid comments.
If there is a CTC challenge in January, perhaps I might be of some use...
However, I have no training or race experience and always feel intimidated by the racing jargon. Could we not have something in layman's terms? I know that Richard would help me, but I'm trying to become a bit more erg savvy myself.
Oh, I and I don't do pain. :) :wink:

Jill :)
User avatar
plummy
Friend of the Free Spirits web site 2020
Friend of the Free Spirits web site 2020
Posts: 8306
Joined: Fri Jul 07, 2006 8:17 am
I row on...: Model E with PM4
Location: Sale, Cheshire, UK

Re: Free Spirits CTC Participation and Leaderboard

Post by plummy »

I think there have been enough references to issue with erging jargon and the possibility of a "Dummies Guide" to everything Free Spirits and the various challenges etc that a sticky thread should be created with all the explanations a novice/newbie/beginner/new team mate could need.

("sticky" - just means the thread stays at the top of the listings and doesn't drop/fade out of sight as newer threads push it down the list)

I'm happy to start working on one this weekend if that's OK with others??

P.S. Jill - No pain is needed - you can pick any pace that suits you - participation is the key.
60 yrs old, 76kg, 5' 10"
43Mm metres rowed. Re-setting the bar much lower now. Getting too old for this malarky
Image
User avatar
Recess
Friend of the Free Spirits web site 2015
Friend of the Free Spirits web site 2015
Posts: 668
Joined: Mon Oct 14, 2013 1:35 pm
I row on...: Model D with PM5
Location: Glasgow
Contact:

Re: Free Spirits CTC Participation and Leaderboard

Post by Recess »

gregsmith01748 wrote: - how to race your first "real" indoor race
A bit of a personal request, and hugely off topic for this thread, but as I've got my first race next Saturday, I'd love to hear some tips!

John
It's not how far you go... It's how go you far.
Image

Follow my training blog as I try to break a world record: http://johntherower.com
User avatar
K_Cat
Stop posting and start rowing!
Posts: 148
Joined: Wed Apr 16, 2014 4:55 am
I row on...: Model D with PM4

Re: Free Spirits CTC Participation and Leaderboard

Post by K_Cat »

Just FYI, I've lost weight and have been consistently under 130lb for months now. In order to not upset any previous CTC boats, I set up a LWT ID as PeggyH, previously PHubbard (HWT). Same slow rower. :roll: :lol:
Image
User avatar
gregsmith01748
Friend of the Free Spirits web site 2015
Friend of the Free Spirits web site 2015
Posts: 1194
Joined: Mon May 02, 2011 4:51 pm
I row on...: Model C with PM4
Location: Hopkinton, MA, USA

Re: Free Spirits CTC Participation and Leaderboard

Post by gregsmith01748 »

Recess wrote:
gregsmith01748 wrote: - how to race your first "real" indoor race
A bit of a personal request, and hugely off topic for this thread, but as I've got my first race next Saturday, I'd love to hear some tips!

John
OK, Here goes.

Indoor races tips:
0. Do a proper taper. The research that I have read says that the most effective taper to maintain intensity and radically cut down volume. My interpretation of this is:
Race day - 5 : normal session
Race day - 4 : race warmup and 4 x 500 at race pace or faster - cool down
Race day - 3 : race warmup and 2 x 500 at race pace or faster - cool down
Race day - 2 : race warmup and 1 x 500 at race pace or faster - cool down
Race day - 1 : If you are nervy do a warmup otherwise nothing.
Race Day : Go get 'em killer.
1. Pack all your stuff the nigh before.
2. What to eat before depends on when your your race is. I like to eat something nice and light about 3 hours before my start time (my choice is a nutella on raisin bread sandwich with a cup of coffee).
3. Go early, very early. Check in early. Get all that stuff our of the way so you can focus on your prep.
4. Scout out bathrooms. I don't know about you, but I get a nervous stomach and before I warm up, I need to spend a little quality time in a bathroom stall. Based on the lines I've seen for the bathrooms, I am not the only one who feels this well.
5. Warm up extra long and extra slow. You will likely end up with a longer wait between warming up and racing than you will normally have in training sessions, so you don't want to be go too easy, but you also don't want to do something to intense and short and then end up fighting off lactic acid hanging around in your quads. This may sound stupid, but practice your warmup. I religiously did my race warmup every single day during my taper for the race.
6. Have a race plan stuck in your brain. Rehearse it, The best rehearsal is to go through the first 1500m of your race about 4 or 5 days prior to the event. Do it exactly as you plan to race your race. Do not sprint the end. Just stop at the 1500m point.
7. As for race plans. Different folks have different ideas. I have always tried to race with flat splits. Just target the split that will give you the time you want and get to that split as quickly as possible. Other folks like the idea of starting a bit fast, then settling a second or two slower for the middle 1000, then crank it up for the last 500.
8. No matter what your race plan is, the important thing is to actually stick to it. Adrenaline will be pumping and you will find that hitting your splits will feel unaturally easy for the first 200m or so. Do not fall for it. You body is a filthy liar and will betray you at the 1000m point if you go with it. Let yourself start fast, but settle to your intended pace with 5 strokes or so.
9. The race start. This is something that I wish I knew more about before my first race. When you erg by yourself, the clock starts when you take your first pull. In an arena race, the clock starts as soon as the word "ROW" appears on your screen. If you hit it right on, then all is good. If you miss it by a fraction of a second, you will see that your average split is abysmally slow. It will combine with the adrenaline effect noted above to convince you that you NEED to row faster than planned to make up for the horror confronting you. Don't worry about it. The fraction of a second will matter less and less as you go along. Stick to the plan, it will work. (Full disclosure: Most people will end up with times in arena races that are a second or so off their best possible because of the arena start. Just accept that this is the case for everyone)
10. If you can possibly get one, use a Cox. Even an arena volunteer, if you don't have someone coming with you. It might actually be better than a non-rower who came with you, unless they know what to expect. With a few words you can tell an experienced cox what your plan is and how to interact with you. My instructions to my ccox were: "I want to hold 1:39 from the start to 1750 and then sprint the last bit. If my rate drops below 30, prompt me to take 10 strokes for form. If I am too fast in the first 1500m, tell me to ease up. Yell at me like crazy in the last 250m. Call me names. Insult my manhood"
11. If you start to feel like you are losing it. Remember this. The pain you feel is going to go away as soon as you finish. If you give up, you will remember giving up for a long time.
Greg - Age: 53 H: 182cm W: 88Kg (should be 83Kg)
Image
Training blog: https://quantifiedrowing.wordpress.com/
User avatar
Recess
Friend of the Free Spirits web site 2015
Friend of the Free Spirits web site 2015
Posts: 668
Joined: Mon Oct 14, 2013 1:35 pm
I row on...: Model D with PM5
Location: Glasgow
Contact:

Re: Free Spirits CTC Participation and Leaderboard

Post by Recess »

That's incredible Greg. Informational, and very inspiring at the end.

Thanks for taking the time to write such a long article. I hope I do it proud a week today!

John
It's not how far you go... It's how go you far.
Image

Follow my training blog as I try to break a world record: http://johntherower.com
User avatar
Paul Victory
Friend of the Free Spirits web site 2016
Friend of the Free Spirits web site 2016
Posts: 10616
Joined: Mon Jul 10, 2006 9:29 pm
I row on...: Model E with PM4
Location: Dublin

Re: Free Spirits CTC Participation and Leaderboard

Post by Paul Victory »

Great write up and excellent advice Greg. I wish I'd read that before doing the RIRC 3 years ago.
M 68 6'1" 124kg (May05), 92kg (Feb06), 122kg (Aug10), 95kg (Sep11), 117kg (Jun13), now 98kg
Image
Rodger
Best Friend (PayPal Subscriber)
Best Friend (PayPal Subscriber)
Posts: 1084
Joined: Mon Feb 20, 2012 1:55 am
I row on...: Model C with PM3
Location: Venlo, Netherlands

Re: Free Spirits CTC Participation and Leaderboard

Post by Rodger »

John, perhaps this thread has one or two additional points that are of use to you:
viewtopic.php?f=7&t=2659
M | 48 | 1.78 m | 76 kg
Image
User avatar
CamiCrew
Friend of the Free Spirits web site 2017
Friend of the Free Spirits web site 2017
Posts: 1138
Joined: Wed Jan 12, 2011 8:59 pm
I row on...: Model D with PM5
Location: California, USA

Re: Free Spirits CTC Participation and Leaderboard

Post by CamiCrew »

Greg's writeup is great, great, GREAT.
A few little things from me:

-- TWO nights before the race, turn in early, get the best sleep you can get. If you end up with a bad night's sleep on race night it won't bother you mentally or physically -- might be nerves, the fire alarm going off, you're in a strange place, whatever. Got that tip from a sports performance site & it works.

--As a corollary, don't try weird new stuff right before the race -- seriously, no new food (hey, Maca Powder!) or new lotion (oops, first-ever allergic reaction) you get the idea. Don't mess with the things that work for you.

-- Circle Greg's Point #8 in red! I've watched, and coxed, knowing our guys' targets up front -- the early-adrenaline effect is powerful even for those who SWORE they would not go out faster than plan. BE SMART JOHN. The fly and die's hit at the 1100-1200 mark. Mentally after you pass 1100, push that marker away and be glad it's behind you.

-- Somewhere after 1200 and down to the 550-to-go range is where I personally enter a state of oblivion, and can no longer think about the race plan. And don't care. This is where the cox becomes all-important. I'm in a black tunnel and only their voice comes through. Very helpful to be coxed by someone who knows to watch for this and say certain things. The end, conversely, is fun for me. I like seeing 500 and love the last 250 or so.

Good luck!

Since we veered off topic... as for encouraging participation, what is the Free Spirit philosophy around a PM to all members? I know it's "come and go as you please, we won't bug you..." but is it only done for the periodic team challenges? Those messages (from Alan I think) have gotten my attention, whether I subsequently acted on them or not. If I got one saying "Congratulations on your xxx milestone!" whatever that might be, and it happened to include a link to the Forum, I might follow it & see various things of interest like the CTC. Just wondering about ways to make it personal to their FS activity without being annoying. Or an annual "glad you're a Free Spirit" greeting, even. I know, corny. :lol: I still remember my first Plummy PM greeting years ago. I thought "what nice people."
-barbara

F Hwt 53 yrs 5'10"
User avatar
Jill
Friend of the Free Spirits web site 2020
Friend of the Free Spirits web site 2020
Posts: 1970
Joined: Sun Jun 01, 2014 1:37 pm
I row on...: Model E with PM5

Re: Free Spirits CTC Participation and Leaderboard

Post by Jill »

plummy wrote:I think there have been enough references to issue with erging jargon and the possibility of a "Dummies Guide" to everything Free Spirits and the various challenges etc that a sticky thread should be created with all the explanations a novice/newbie/beginner/new team mate could need.

("sticky" - just means the thread stays at the top of the listings and doesn't drop/fade out of sight as newer threads push it down the list)

I'm happy to start working on one this weekend if that's OK with others??

P.S. Jill - No pain is needed - you can pick any pace that suits you - participation is the key.
Thank you Plummy - I think that's an excellent idea. :D
I was only joking about the pain. :)
User avatar
Recess
Friend of the Free Spirits web site 2015
Friend of the Free Spirits web site 2015
Posts: 668
Joined: Mon Oct 14, 2013 1:35 pm
I row on...: Model D with PM5
Location: Glasgow
Contact:

Re: Free Spirits CTC Participation and Leaderboard

Post by Recess »

Thanks Barbara, all these tips will hopefully sink in. Can't promise I won't be tempted to fly and die, but Julie will be sitting behind me making me behave.

Back on topic, i wish I was able to help, but I'm still a bit raw. However an "I'm a Free Sprirt, what do I do now?" Idea for a stickie that new members are directed to on sign up could hopefully do a lot of good.

John
It's not how far you go... It's how go you far.
Image

Follow my training blog as I try to break a world record: http://johntherower.com
Terra Firma
Warming up
Posts: 32
Joined: Sat Feb 22, 2014 8:38 pm
I row on...: Model C with PM3

Re: Free Spirits CTC Participation and Leaderboard

Post by Terra Firma »

Excellent tips, Greg. I will re-read before this winter's ergattas for sure. I also appreciate Barbara's pointers on eating things that are familiar and getting a good penultimate night's sleep. I never seem to sleep well on the night before a race. Good luck next week, John.

I will add my tip: Have fun! You have trained extensively to get fit. If you mind Greg and Barbara, you will be rested and ready. Enjoy the ride. Racing side-by-side with others is a lot more exciting than toiling away at training sessions.
- Chris
Age: 53 Height: 196cm Weight: 102kg

Image
Rodger
Best Friend (PayPal Subscriber)
Best Friend (PayPal Subscriber)
Posts: 1084
Joined: Mon Feb 20, 2012 1:55 am
I row on...: Model C with PM3
Location: Venlo, Netherlands

Re: Free Spirits CTC Participation and Leaderboard

Post by Rodger »

It's very easy to get back on topic when a new month starts. :D
We had 36 participants in November, which is around the year average.

I don't know what happened to Andy, but he didn't make boat 1 this month. Liefcat is the new leader! ^O^
Two new names emerged: Neil Fairbairn and Boris Lewandowski. Welcome! :fsgrin:

The full list is here:
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc ... MTWc#gid=4

As for the Club 50 (all-time participation list), the only nice round number I will mention this month is that Stan did his 110th CTC for Free Spirits! =D>

Image
M | 48 | 1.78 m | 76 kg
Image
User avatar
strider77
Free Spirit forever
Posts: 6157
Joined: Wed Dec 19, 2007 1:43 pm
I row on...: Model D with PM5
Location: Near Brighton

Re: Free Spirits CTC Participation and Leaderboard

Post by strider77 »

Great job Rodger thanks for all the hard work :D :wink:
[b]67 5ft 10ins tall, 80k, proud to be a Free Spirit[/b]
[img]https://tinyurl.com/fsrsigs/fssig-285.png[/img]
User avatar
Stan
Friend of the Free Spirits web site 2016
Friend of the Free Spirits web site 2016
Posts: 9405
Joined: Mon Jul 03, 2006 9:28 pm
I row on...: Model C with PM4
Location: Malvern

Re: Free Spirits CTC Participation and Leaderboard

Post by Stan »

Thanks for the update Rodger.
Already got number 111 in :D
pb times
Image
User avatar
K_Cat
Stop posting and start rowing!
Posts: 148
Joined: Wed Apr 16, 2014 4:55 am
I row on...: Model D with PM4

Re: Free Spirits CTC Participation and Leaderboard

Post by K_Cat »

No points for Nov? :( I was in FS #5 Hoping to row the CTC every month. :fssmile:

Peggy
Image
Rodger
Best Friend (PayPal Subscriber)
Best Friend (PayPal Subscriber)
Posts: 1084
Joined: Mon Feb 20, 2012 1:55 am
I row on...: Model C with PM3
Location: Venlo, Netherlands

Re: Free Spirits CTC Participation and Leaderboard

Post by Rodger »

K_Cat wrote:No points for Nov? :( I was in FS #5 Hoping to row the CTC every month. :fssmile:

Peggy
Sorry Peggy, my mistake! :oops:
I remember adding your lwt name to your previous one on the list, but for some reason I gave your points to Gregor Andrews.

It's corrected now. :fsgrin: Thanks for noticing!
Last edited by Rodger on Thu Dec 04, 2014 11:15 am, edited 1 time in total.
M | 48 | 1.78 m | 76 kg
Image
Post Reply